Solo Quests

Discussion in 'Adventure Discussion and Strategy' started by Bykuzplastiku, Aug 16, 2015.

  1. DunDunDun

    DunDunDun Thaumaturge

    Byukez didn't indicate 'more quests', they indicated an entirely new mode with improved loot drops.
    I've no issue with adding new solo-unit or complete-within-x-rounds or other Quests since, as you noted, they're optional- and limited in ability to play.
    Entirely different from the inclusion of a 'harder difficulty tier', where the 'difficulty' is based of faulty premises, and doesn't actually exist for most instances, with improved loot, and ability to replay.

    All my pointing out of flaws, was based on this concept.

    For the format of quests, the basic idea fits right in.

    In any case, the rest of your post seems to be based on the premise I was naysaying quest additions, so I'll cut off here :)
    Killer74 and Bykuzplastiku like this.
  2. Killer74

    Killer74 Hydra

    Ah right, my apologies, I should have read more carefully. In that case, I agree with you.

    I'm not sure if a new mode would add much that they wouldn't as quests at any rate. Many of the quests wouldn't be any different than an ordinary run (use..., no deaths) in "Hell" mode. Others would essentially be impossible (1 hp). There are some overlaps where they would be interesting, but one can always make up one's own challenges without having to rely on the game (let's be honest: Difficult quests aren't worth the time for loot), as indeed, has been done here. The only one one can't play is the 1 hp one, one can equip handicaps, use specific characters, reduced levels (though this one is harder to organise) if one feels so inclined.
    Bykuzplastiku and DunDunDun like this.
  3. Bykuzplastiku

    Bykuzplastiku Orc Soldier

    Good that we have different approaches to the game and still we both have found it very entertaining in our own ways. I am 100% cool and thanks for nice discussion. It is always good to see things as other people see them (if somebody is patient enough as you are to explain).

    That would be great! I am not insisting on playing current adventures solo or duo. Just looking for something to play in PvE.

    And that is my current issue with the CH. After a while when you face another quest/adventure there is nothing to figure out! You just do random build and smash through the maps, splashing enemies blood, scorching and cursing them with radiation ;). There is little challenge. So looking for one you can try to finish an adventure with certain build that nobody think off earlier, as you described. Limiting the number of party members is the roughly same idea. I would open Nightmare and Hells mode only for those who finished all adventures and majority of the quests. And i am not asking for much bigger reward there. Nothing to force ppl to play there in order to keep the pace in multiplayer with those who do or anything like that. If you have finished all adventures and majority of the quests you wont lack knowledge, items etc. to at least try it.

    I have to disagree here but I fully accept you point of view! The soloquesting gives me completely new look both on the build of the class as well as on the adventure itself. I have learnt a ton about priest (maybe one can learn the same thing playing multiplayer). Some of adventures aren't that much harder, i agree. They are different. It makes you rethink the game. Trying to figure out strategy and tactics one can dig into really surprising solutions. Although there are maps that are very difficult and nice thing is that i was really surprised. They were not the maps i suspect to be hard. I still remember dancing against three mailed skeleton warriors in that damn narrow corridor.

    I would love to have 50 or 250 more adventures of different levels (or really good and easy to use game-master module with playable monsters - i can pay for that :), developers, can you here me? :D) but it wont happens anytime soon. So waiting for that i would love to try all the quests again with 2 or even 1 character. And yes i was frustrated many times, but that make me think and going back to the game to try and try another solution ;).

    But i am fully aware that my approach is rather unique, and there are not many players who are interested in such challenges or soloquesting. So really i am convinced that adding it would make more controversy then fun.
    Killer74 likes this.
  4. timeracers

    timeracers Guild Leader

    I would like to point out that completionists would have to complete them because that is what they do, and I am one.
    Bykuzplastiku likes this.
  5. Bykuzplastiku

    Bykuzplastiku Orc Soldier

    That is interesting comment. So you are pointing out that if the developers create quests that are impossible to complete (like 1hp solo, warrior whatever) then you would get frustrated? That is in fact a strong argument against such ideas as this one.
    timeracers likes this.
  6. DunDunDun

    DunDunDun Thaumaturge

    The points you quoted aren't REALLY disagreeable, at least not without indication why you think they wouldn't occur.
    They're not subjective points,
    but firm potential flaws in just slapping solo-questing onto existing modules as a new mode.
    As such, you'd need to counter the points made to really 'disagree' :)

    Not saying these things would happen, but that they're valid concerns when approaching the matter from the specific idea you mentioned.
    Seems a lot easier to just add solo in as its own new section or as Quests, and avoid any potential problems :)

    I wasn't arguing the addition of solo elements, just pointing out actual potential mechanical issues with approaching things too carelessly :)

    Besides that, have you been following Caverns of Chaos over on testing server?
    Pretty sure that'll be eating a fair bit of our time once it hits live- and it looks like it'll address BOTH boredom and lack-of-challenge concerns :)

    I assume you mean the addition of solo Quests, not the non-completable new-mode idea Bykuz initially suggested :)

    I used to be a completionist, and I can testify to that. It's.. frustrating not having something finished :D
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2015
  7. Flaxative

    Flaxative Party Leader

    They are totally subjective dude. Your 'problems' with his suggestion presume the acceptance of a lot of premises that might be held by a wide section of the playerbase but are not fundamentally True. Refusing to let someone disagree with your subjective objections is a bit much. Let it go :)
    Han Lee likes this.
  8. hello world

    hello world Hydra

    Maybe a mode where you can solo things as a character with no level reduction?
  9. Bykuzplastiku

    Bykuzplastiku Orc Soldier

    I have meant that i understand your point of view and have no problem with that :). I thought that i have addressed to your points already throughout my previous posts but i can highlight it again.

    You only allow players who have specific gear to play. Anyone who can't build right has to wait to have a good shot. This could discourage newer players.

    This is the true for the big chunk of the quests or even some specific and hard adventures. Without specific gear it is very difficult to compete and complete them. So this is not a specific flaw of my idea but more of the CH itself. Also as i pointed earlier - my "nightmare" and "hells" modes would open only after finishing all adventures on the previous mode (like in old Diablo) and also maybe large part of the quests. As i said before this would prevent ppl with little gear and even less experience to be frustrated.

    Your 'challenge' isn't much of a challenge at all, since most modules aren't noticeably harder to solo.

    Ok, even if the most of them aren't harder they are at least different, giving you a chance to know better a class, know better builds and equipment, learn better how to move and use all advantages you can have. You have to play different to finish them. Also still there is a big part of adventures or maps that are more difficult and as i mentioned above you would be surprised because maps that are very easy on the normal mode sometimes are very difficult on solo. This maps were named here and there on the forum as a challenging for a single character.

    And finally :)

    Your challenge goes to frustrating levels on the subset of modules that aren't easier- if people don't like to play Troll Tyrant, which has a HANDFUL of possible approaches to make it easy, how will they feel about even more frustrating circumstances, with fewer available approaches?

    If they dont like it, why should they play it? Unless they are completionist, but i have already said that i respect those ppl and i admit it is strong argument against implementation of something that is almost impossible to do. Although the Kongregate were i played the CH has got so called "impossible badges" and some of them are beyond my imagination of how it is possible to finish them without cheating :D. New modes with all the quests of the PvE avaliabe for duo or solo for sure would be impossible to finish in certain places. Like 1hp warrior solo Black Plume or something like that.

    Overall i have just sharing my thought on soloquesting because i have complete with a single priest all the maps except 4 and recently all 2-8 lvl maps with a warrior. So it is a bit more then speculation and i think i am not so careless with my ideas :). Still as i said before i am really far from lunching any type of crusade in order to add such content ;). I can enjoy it as it is now (without access to duo/solo-quests /rewards).

    I am not the nativespeaker and maybe sometimes i read your intention wrong. Thanks for nice discussion and keeping this thread alive. BTW i have heard about CoC, looking forward to it.
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2015
  10. Bykuzplastiku

    Bykuzplastiku Orc Soldier

    Too easy :). C'mmon :). Really, if you are experienced player with some stuff solo is not that much harder then normal. DunDunDun is right there, although there are exceptions and some of them are as almost hard as 1hp quest.
  11. DunDunDun

    DunDunDun Thaumaturge

    You're talking quality and overall selection of gear, and the requirements of farming it out. I'm not talking about anything like that at all :)
    I'm saying that- okay, as an example, imagine if you HAD to play a fire mage every single map. Any other build would make you lose.
    Same basic concept- cycling, vampirism, immunity would likely dominate single player builds, and make any other build extremely difficult to play. By comparison, if you play 'the right build', it'd be very easy to run the adventures you suggest.

    And that kind of imbalance is FINE for Quests, which are all kinda imbalanced- but for a REPEATABLE mode, that doesn't require other players to repeat [like Quests do], you'd find people permanently farming the easiest modules.

    There wouldn't even be any incentive to play the harder modes in more difficult modules.
    You're not explaining why Quests wouldn't work for it, or even better, new modes altogether, DESIGNED around making a challenging experience where you can better learn game concepts and build design.

    You haven't explained why slapping a new mode onto existing modules, where there'd be a lot of difficulty imbalance between modules, is preferable. :)

    This whole bit is confusing.
    They'd do it, because it'd be an improved mode with better loot drops, according to you, and is repeatable. Or rather, they'd do the easy modules in that mode, and ignore all the hard ones, meaning that instead of being a 'harder, more challenging mode', it'd end up being a 'easy farm mode'.

    But yeah, again, I totally dig challenge modes, so I'm all in favor of adding in new modules or Quests based around the idea; just not slapping it on top of existing modules as a repeatable mode. :)

    So far I respect you a lot; I have difficulty with language myself, and I think I sometimes come across sounding somewhat irritated [and I never mean to].

    But confusions eventually always happen when talking to other people :)

    You're willing to keep calmly and respectfully interacting with me, without attacking me or mocking me or dismissing me, and that makes you a far more respect-worthy person than most people out there :)

    Thanks for assuming the best intentions from my posts, and not the worst- too few people do that :)
    Bykuzplastiku likes this.
  12. Bykuzplastiku

    Bykuzplastiku Orc Soldier

    I haven't thought about farming. The solution is not to give more loot on the duo and solo mode, isn't it? Opening the quests modes again would be enough, and they are one shot (but finishing them will be difficult). So you could get opportunity to loot again quests chests only. But i would disagree that solo makes you use less builds then normal game. I think opposite. Now i'm playing solo warrior. I have to change the setup every adventure because i cannot cover holes of my warrior deck with the cards of other characters. Till lvl 10 adventures i have already used piercing (eg. trogs), bashing (some heavy orcs), crushing, slashing (eg. kobolds), steeping (eg. geomancers), tank and run, and one/two shot kamikaze setups :), all on the dwarf.

    It would work even better. I agree. Cannot argue with that. But its easier to add such modes to current game then to develop specific adventures. This is my only argument here.


    Keeping the thread on the topic, i think that up to lvl 10 solo warrior is easier then solo priest. I suspect that further would be worse because lack of nimbus and healing. There are bubble helms and shoes available for warrior but i am not sure if it would help. Up to now for many adventures the good strategy was to try to deal death blows with punishing strikes combined with a frenzy and crushing bonus. Also barbed plate combined with reliable mail is good armour combo. Although there are many exceptions where specific weapons or arrogant armour is needed.

    I encourage ppl to try solo priest the Black Plume Mountain or Secrets of the Elder Mind. The BPM i was able to finish first and second map, the SoTEM i cannot get through the first map. Maybe somebody can do it!
    DunDunDun likes this.

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