Pick Order for Bad Handicap Cards

Discussion in 'Adventure Discussion and Strategy' started by Obernoob, Nov 12, 2015.

  1. Obernoob

    Obernoob Hydra

    Here we go. The A Guide to Quick Draw already provides some hints:

    The list has some inconsistency in putting Slowed and Demonic Miasma above Ill-Fitting Armor, as I think all are usually good. But so be it.

    I want to focus on the really bad cards. Assuming you have to choose a trait for your warrior on the chess map, which of the following would you choose and why?

    Fumble, Trip, Fright, Cowardly or Large Weapon?
  2. BlackVoidDeath

    BlackVoidDeath Guild Leader

    IMO The best black card is Travelling Curse, and that list is Jade's opinion.
    Oh god thats a tough one... depending on my tactic/gold card - if its a block/I am focusing armor and blocks then Cowardly or Large Weapon, if its an attack/I am focusing attacks then Trip but never, NEVER EVER pick Fumble.
  3. Obernoob

    Obernoob Hydra

    Defintly. I was in that situation and picked Large Weapon above some of the others. My ratio was, that at least I have a chance on playing my attacks. Turned out I never won any of the saving rolls. But I still think it is better than Fright or Cowardly.
    I think it also depends, whether you already have a Purge or Purging Burst on a priest. Would you pick one of the handicaps you can purge away, if you draft the warrior before the priest, hoping to get a purge? In that case Trip is ok on a warrior which you can park on the VP, isnt it?
    BlackVoidDeath likes this.
  4. BlackVoidDeath

    BlackVoidDeath Guild Leader

    Trip is not too bad because it only lasts for one round, though in saying that, a lot of stuff can happen in one round.
    If I was making a warrior first, I wouldnt hope for purge on a priest, I would just rather use a card like Ouch!
  5. Sir Veza

    Sir Veza Farming Deity

    Fumble, because it only discards one card, and if you know it's coming it can be easier to play around.
    Trip and Fright are attached for your attackers to see and act upon. The same goes for Large Weapon, although it's effect is dicey. (Pun intended.) I get a lot of double Parry fails, so I avoid it. Drawing Cowardly tells your opponent you have 0 or 1 attack.
    I'm not saying my answer is right, but it's my opinion. I usually get at least one better choice than those listed.

    Situational evaluation:
    If you have elves facing dwarves, Travelling Curse is horrible.
    If you have dwarves facing elves, Travelling Curse is awesome. Pray for it.
    FDrybob likes this.
  6. BlackVoidDeath

    BlackVoidDeath Guild Leader

    I once had a game with 5 travelling curses flying around a map :D (I won)
  7. peonprop

    peonprop Thaumaturge

    It's less useful to identify the best of these handicaps than it is to pick the 2 worst. If you can decide which 2 you would ditch no matter what you will always know what to pick. That said, these choices aren't so black and white because of how many factors go into making them. For instance, you might want a more brutal attachment based handicap if you previously picked up some buffs that can potentially knock it off. Prioritize picking up some boosts as well and that Large Weapon may as well not be there. If you're forced to take a Trip early on, you can try to load up on command cards like Dash, Team! and control spells like Telekinesis. Fumble may be the least detrimental effect in a vacuum but it also happens to be the only one whose effect can't be minimized through other card choices. Long story short, card rankings can be great for inexperienced players but once you get a handle on things, you should really avoid going by the book and just go with your gut. Or someone else's gut if anyone wants to write a really really in depth quick draw strategy guide ;).
    FDrybob, timeracers and Sir Veza like this.
  8. Obernoob

    Obernoob Hydra

    Which would be a cool thing. Currently I only have enough time for my little farming project in Mission: Max Usable. But I hope to have more spare time in the new year (as I hope every year:D) to start a new project. A guid for farming would be an interesting one, another one a guid for quick draw. Since I put a lot of time in optimizing my farming builds, I preferable would share them first, if there is any interest. To be honest another choice would be to stream some Magic the Gathering Cube drafts. I am not sure at this point, which project I will realize first.
  9. Happenstance

    Happenstance Thaumaturge

    I've thought about writing something similar but it's so situational, depending on the map, your party build and what you are facing.

    For example, Demonic Revenge is great on a pure support priest with Inspiring Presence or even Team or Triple Heal. On the other hand, unless I'd already drawn a guaranteed purge, and I wasn't facing enemy priests, I'd never ever take Trip.

    I've probably missed a couple.

    Arcane Feedback: generally harmless, good for drawing OP blocks/toughness, can be great with buffing.
    Arcane Curse: inferior to ^^^, worse negative effect, if you're close enough to use it, your mage is going to get whacked.
    Backbiting Strike: see Arcane Feedback, would take Weak Strike over this unless I was hoping for quality armour draws.
    Brain Burn: never been a fan (maybe on a dwarf but never on an elf), ideally requires armour which is rarer on mages.
    Combustible: never vs mages, especially more than one mage, unless you have a spare purge. Note that if you're facing priests as well, you can never be sure of having spare purges (entangling roots, nimbus, unholy wellspring, stone feet, etc etc). Plus there are always those fighters packing Force Field.
    Cowardly: yes on a support priest and only on a support priest.
    Defensiveness: mage vs mage or mage vs dwarves on an open map with screening characters? Yes. But I've completely wiped teams with double defensiveness/support priest just by moving an elf mage around with them.
    Demonic Miasma: see Arcane Feedback.
    Demonic Revenge: absolutely yes on support group healers and draining priests.
    Dropped Guard: tentative yes on a hit and run / coup de grace fighter. Definite yes on a support priest (without Cause Fumble or Defender's, of course).
    Fright: not a fan at all, I've seen it lose far more games than it wins. Works with spare purges. If you take it, make sure to not take any more traits.
    Ill-fitting Armor: cripples dwarves, but it's okay on elf fighters and great on support priests.
    Large Weapon: see Fright.
    Loner: see Demonic Revenge, but this is superior. Yes.
    Mind Leak: brilliant on war priests (but not draining priests), but never on mage vs mage, unless spare purges. Note that the purge option puts you a move behind every turn as you use your first move to purge away the attachment. This can be critical in QD.
    Obvious Maneuver: I don't like it, but it's only a problem in the first couple of rounds. Still, it nullifies certain cards, so good luck landing chops if you take it.
    Ouch!: see Brain Burn. Not a fan.
    Slowed: potentially harmless. Good early as a turn waster to force the opponent to act first, bad late if you're trying to flee.
    Superstitious: has to be managed with an iron will. I've never been a fan of it, because I've seen it destroy games (on both sides).
    Travelling Curse: absolutely yes with dwarves and/or armour and/or healing. Will eventually destroy armourless elves with no healing.
    Trip: awful unless spare purge. See Fright.
    Vulnerable: ^^^, awful vs mages, but can be creative bait if you give it to a character with decent armour/healing.
    Weak Strike: the less harmful Backbiting, it's my default go-to if the other drawbacks are worse.
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2015
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  10. PurpleRed

    PurpleRed Orc Soldier

    How I choose my drawback card:

    No-Brainer Tier: (The mostly harmless draw cards)
    Obvious Maneuver, Travelling Curse (with hp/priest advantage), Combustible (no enemy wiz), Dropped Guard, Loner.

    Acceptable Tier: (The non-draw cards)
    Arcane Feedback, Weak/Backbiting strike, Demonic Miasma, Arcane curse (can usually spend or discard), Slowed, Ill-fitting armour.

    "Didn't Want" Tier:
    Ouch, Brain Burn, Combustible (1 enemy wiz), Travelling Curse (with hp/priest disadvantage), Demonic Revenge, Defensiveness, Fumble.

    "NOOOO" Tier:
    Fright, Mind leak (Wiz), Vulnerable, Combustible (2+ enemy wiz), Large Weapon.

    Will Not Touch Tier:
    Trip, Cowardly, Superstitious.
  11. Obernoob

    Obernoob Hydra

    I dont like that one at all. I would take a Backbiting Strike, Weak Strike and Arcane Feedback all day over it. Against melee I want to have the chance to pick up a Parry, which is huge. Against mages a Reliable Armor or even a Shimming Aura is a huge advantage. I will take it over most of your didnt want handicaps. The other choices are fine. :)
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  12. Happenstance

    Happenstance Thaumaturge

    Yeah, where Dropped Guard works is with 2 or 3 fighters / war priests. You make one fighter your block/armour guy, and the Dropped Guard (coup de grace) guy puts everything into movement and attacks. Block guy goes in first and takes the heat, coup de grace guy follows up to take out wounded characters.
    FDrybob likes this.
  13. Obernoob

    Obernoob Hydra

    That is possible. I also pick Dropped Guard higher after picking an Impaling Stab.
    FDrybob likes this.
  14. PurpleRed

    PurpleRed Orc Soldier

    Yeah, there are potential downsides. But unless you took defense as the gold card, you are being offered a guaranteed card advantage with Dropped Guard. I consider this more valuable than the gamblers option of holding out for a prime block/armor.

    I find a more serious problem with Dropped Guard is when playing against someone who is taking along time to select their cards. My mind wanders and I forget I took dropped guard. Then I instinctively quick-click the good block/armour when it comes up, remembering Dropped Guard just as I click... NOOOOOO.
  15. Obernoob

    Obernoob Hydra

    I know that feeling. In many matchups Parry is an instant pick. And if I have a second warrior and hoped before for a Parry and then there it is. :D
  16. haesslicherBob

    haesslicherBob Lizardman Priest

    Oh yes, I hate when this happens...

    On topic: I think it is not easy to generalize a picking order. There are so many factors to think about (my team composition, enemy team composition, do I want to rush the vp or snipe at the enemy from a far...). For example if my Priest picks Inspiring Presence as gold (which is almost an auto pick on the oozeball map for example), I will pick a trait on black at any circumstances (even if I only get choices i usually would avoid, like Fright, Demonic Revenge, Superstitious...).

    I learned a few things the hard way:
    - Picking black traits (the non harmless ones) over things like Weak Strike or Arcane Feedback may be risky, but can yield you a "gold card advantage". Cycling through your deck to get your gold and silver cards as much as possible will win you games.
    - Avoid Defensiveless on a wizard, if you face two or more warriors on a cramped map. They will always rush you...
    - I do not like Superstitious on a warrior. Chances are he will get stranded in the middle of the map and the remaining opponents can hack you to pieces. Superstitious on a support character in the backfield is more bearable.
    - Picking Combustible if the enemy has no wizard sounds like the best idea since sliced bread. Countless times I got fiery stabbed, though... (I still pick it nevertheless)
    - I personally think Slowed is one of the worst picks. It is a dead card up to 95% (will become a walk if you pick movement enhancer on bronze/silver) and even hinders you.
    - I dislike Trip on any character on any map. A big part of the game is about positioning. If you really pick it, avoid too many other cycling cards on Silver, Bronze and Paper or you will never leave your starting position ;)
    - Similar advice if you take "weak" damaging traits like Ouch! or Loner: The more additional traits you pick, the more you ll draw your damaging trait. Keep this in mind if you lack a healer. Chances are you kill or weaken yourself in an extended long match (rule of thumb: a match will be the shorter the more warriors, less priests and less vps are involved)
    - As Tempting as Ill-fitting armor is, keep in mind that it might be a bad idea on a slow dwarf warrior, who starts far away from the vp.
  17. Obernoob

    Obernoob Hydra

    On a support character or wizard it can be ok, especially if they are elves. You just keep it forever in hand. It is defintly better than trip or frigth.

    Definitly. Even with purges it is the worst.

    I think it is more about virtual slots. When I pick I count the number of cards I have to keep, for example armors or blocks. The non-traiting handicaps take up one of this two virtual slots. If I have just picked up a Defender's Block for example, I dislike even Weak Strike, because it means I should not pick up another block or armor. Nevertheless Weak Strike is a pretty good card, because you can run it easily into blocks. And if you have spare virtual slots it is just great to have a sometimes useful card.
  18. Predaking

    Predaking Orc Soldier

    I like Festering Gut on handicap quests.

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