Let's talk about: Game Difficulty!

Discussion in 'Feedback and Suggestions' started by Pengw1n, Mar 15, 2013.

  1. Tobold

    Tobold Goblin Champion

    I think this is the core of the "game is too difficult in the early levels" complaints. The maps are *not* difficult at all if you already have a large collection of cards and replay them with a fresh low level party. But the first time you play the game you are likely to not have access to the cards you need, whether that is range-2 spears, armor dissolving cards, or block-removing cards. If your warrior is still wielding a low-level common weapon, an armored Trog or Golem is a fearsome opponent indeed.

    "Farming" gear early on isn't so easy, because of the "can only play adventure once per day" restriction. I was wondering if that restriction should be removed for adventures up to level 6.
  2. Pengw1n

    Pengw1n Moderately Informed Staff Member

    Tbh, I haven't replayed the game after beating it (played through a few resets however) - so I wouldn't agree about the gear collection Tobold. It certainly helps to have a huge library of items, but I beat it without buying chests (maybe 3 max?).
  3. Forduc

    Forduc Orc Soldier

    I'll pipe in my opinion as this threat came up...

    I played my campaing through in previous version (2.16). It was pretty much optimal for casual play for me. I played without club and didn't buy anything from stores. I only ended up replaying 4 or 5 adventures, which constitutes as pretty easy for me. PvP gear helped fair bit, as they were probably only major power items I had when I got major powers.

    Also I didn't have to grind for gear in any shape or form. I might have replayed one adventure and leveled second team a bit (around 3-5 adventures when primary was 10+). Also skipped pvp before finishing campaign. But it took lots of gear changing.

    Bottom line is that campaign was borderline too easy. Gearchanging was also tedious and mostly guesswork for first battle of each adventure. It's also very annoying that you can't easily change gear after seeing description of the next battle. It would still be same kind of guesswork as first battle, but atleast you wouldn't have to click out of adventure and fix stuff there. Allthough 3 retries is usually enough, skipping initial gear selection just because it's too clumsy will annoy beyond no end when you fail the adventure.
  4. Assussanni

    Assussanni Ogre

    I haven't read all of the post in this thread, but here are my thoughts:

    Initial game difficulty was very good, with the exception of The White Star (I played the previous version I believe, it has since been rebalanced) which I had to skip and come back to. As soon as I got my first item with Wall Of Fire on it, around level 7 or 8 iirc, the game felt a little too simple until level 16 when I encountered a map with trees that would often result in my poor elf wizard getting squished on turn 1 and also the appearance of the terrifying War Monkeys, or #%@!ing Monkeys as I believe they are sometimes known on the forum.

    In between these levels I encountered several named "boss" enemies who would simply melt in my pools of conjured molten rock far too quickly to make them feel like they were a worthy challenge. This seemed like a real shame, as I'm sure they have some interesting cards that I never got to see and the final battle of an adventure often felt a little anti-climactic.

    One thing that I'm sure must have been mentioned but that I haven't seen is a discussion of is having different difficulty settings for the campaign. From what little I understand of the board editor I can't imagine that it would be too tricky to have an easy, medium and hard version of each map with differing numbers or types of enemies. Maybe even different numbers of battles in a given adventure (although I realise this may give some issues with quantities of loot received)? I read a lot about how taxing the pre-Beta 2.xx adventures were and I would have loved to try them.

    Hmmm, this post is coming across as quite negative. I'll end on a positive note by saying that in spite of the above points I thoroughly enjoyed playing through the campaign!
  5. I first struggled around the Level 5-7 adventures, which was mostly due to not knowing more than basic strategies and lack of Hot Spot; Then again on Map 2 of Compass of Xorr due to reasons I still not figured out and since then I didn't encounter any big problems.

    So in my opinion the learning curve should be less steep, but overall the game difficulty is okay with tendencies to too easy on higher levels.
  6. Indii

    Indii Kobold

    Okay, I do not want to sound too whiny, but after having played a couple of days I am completely stuck and do not know how I could possibly progress anymore. My heroes are all level 7, but I am not able to beat a single one of the level 6/7 adventures. The frustrating thing is not the difficulty itself, but rather that I am simply not able to see how I could probably become good enough to beat those adventures. Previously, I needed to replay some of the stages, because I did not have the right strategy right away. That is okay and fun and a challenge. But after the fifth time in every available level, it is just frustrating. I replayed a couple of the older adventures, but the loot does not become better and the experience gain is almost non-existent, so there seems to be no real value in doing that hour after hour. It almost seems like I am missing something, because the game has changed so suddenly from being a good challenge to being downright impossible. I am not a complete stranger to card games, board games and strategy games, so this really puzzles me. And it is a shame, because otherwise I think the game looks, plays, and feels fantastic.
  7. Unlucky Scarecrow

    Unlucky Scarecrow Goblin Champion

    Is it the trogs? You might have to find as many penetrating attacks as you can. Stepping attacks may also work; The added maneuverability would help you reach a Trog's backside, where their Crude Plate will fail to work.
  8. Blindsight

    Blindsight Ogre

    This is a hard stage for a lot of people it seems. What is it exactly you are having the most issues with?

    Gear helps, but also learning what enemies to attack, how to position correctly etc seems to be more important at this stage. The bridge on Beneath the Frozen earth (with the trogs) can be really rough even with good play and decent gear. The key to that (I feel) is acid blasts or acid sprays if you have them. Really anything to get rid of their armor.

    Also, to give yourself more room to maneuver, you may want to think about always only moving just one square out of range so you have a little more freedom behind you. Move away from the enemies that have to go over difficult terrain since they will take longer to get to you and try to clean up on the others first. The kobolds and all of their blocks can be ruthless against melee attacks. Any area of effect spells you have are useful, which includes global spells like elvish insight and even chops. Anything to get them to start discarding multiple blocks with only one of your cards.
  9. Indii

    Indii Kobold

    Thanks for the hints. And don't misunderstand me. I'm not really giving up on the game. To be a bit more specific: I really have problems with almost all available level 6/7 stages right. I haven't the level 8 ones yet. But I imagine they are not easier. Here are some examples:

    The Defense of Woodhome: I found out how to deal with the skeletons and their armor in stage 2. But in stage 3, the skeletons are much stronger. I know the hint says I shouldn't kill them, but avoid or stall them. I tried, but they always go for the victory spots, so luring them away didn't work and if I try to stall them, two of my guys are dead at the end of the round.

    Beneath the Frozen Earth: The troggs do a lot of damage. So I can't really go into close combat, which makes my warrior pretty useless. If I do, he usually dies. I have a few violent swings, but the rest of my melee attacks mostly do around 3 damage. Most of the times, I can't even make a considerable amount of damage before he dies.

    The White Star (I hope I remember this correctly): In the last stage, I'm always swarmed by enemies. I tried to move to different regions of the board, but I can't escape them. At one point, I am always surrounded by five or more enemies. And then it's game over.

    Like I said, I won't give up. But at the moment, I miss that moment where I can see "Ah, that's how it might work!" Concerning gear, I probably made a few mistakes. I usually give the best stuff to my guys and sell the rest. So I don't really have alternative gear at the moment. I have have thought about this more from an RPG perspective and less from a card game perspective.
  10. Blindsight

    Blindsight Ogre

    You haven't mentioned your party composition. I started with a Dwarf warrior, Dwarf cleric and Elf wizard. I got to a certain point (around lvl 10) and decided I had to start a new party because this just wasn't working for me.

    A few thoughts -- and assuming you have a Warrior, Wizard and Cleric:

    If you don't have decently powered attack cards on your weapons, what about turning your fighter into a tank and taking as many sustaining items (heals/blocks etc) as possible while letting your longer ranged wizard take them out.

    Never underestimate backing yourself into a corner. Sometimes that's the best way to deal with a lot of enemies.

    You may simply want to try starting another party. By the time you get back up to level 8 you'll have a wider variety of items as well as characters to swap in and out as needed. Some maps you might just want two wizards and a cleric (like I did with my second party) or two warriors and a cleric if you're finding you are getting a lot of good items for warriors.

    The random nature is more impactful when you start out because you don't have a lot of resources. Starting up a second party, I think, is the best way to combat that.
  11. Koriel

    Koriel Kobold

    From what I've played so far (up to level 8), the difficulty of the encounters "per se" is just right. The problem arises from the availability of the cards.

    Putting aside the often discussed item drops and how better items dramatically improve the chances of success, in my opinion, the biggest problem, that I haven't seen discussed much, is the availability of cards when drawing for a new turn.

    Too often I get only movement and armor/block cards with no offensive cards. Or on the contrary, I get a very lucky draw with some very high damage cards and take out a golem or any other high hp/high damage opponent in 1 turn. Or for another example, in the kobold mines, when overwhelmed and trying to force all kobolds through a chokepoint, and you get no damage cards. I finished that map by surviving with just the mage and running around the map corridors for half an hour waiting to draw some good spell cards.

    The solution is already available in the way the racial move cards are implemented: on any new turn, you always draw a move card. Why not extend this to class specific cards:
    - warrior always draws at least 1 attack card
    - mage always draws at least 1 damaging spell card
    - cleric always draws at least 1 healing card
  12. Kalin

    Kalin Begat G'zok

    That sounds like your biggest mistake. I used to sell just treasures, but now I don't even sell them. Did you spend all your gold yet? If not, try recruiting some new chars of different race/class combos and leveling them up. And when fighting kobolds, try chopping weapons instead of those Kobold Killers.

    Yesterday I leveled my second party from 4 to 7 so I could swap out my elf priest, and that gave me a party that could beat the Frozen Earth without trouble. Here's what I used:
    Level 7 Dwarf Warrior

    Level 7 Human Wizard

    Level 7 Dwarf Priest

    And the third battle would have been over real fast if I had used Firestorms.
  13. My thoughts:
    My team is now level 9, I just did qualification for gladiator tournament quest. I bought 3 chests, and it is first time i play the game and it is a first team i am leveling up: dwarf warrior, human mage and human cleric.
    I went fast through adventures level 1-7 (no restarts, one or two battles lost), and then i failed twice one of level 8 adventures (had to restart it). Melvelous was very, very tough (though final battle went easy enough), and last mission of lord Stafford was very annoying due to time restriction. Melvelous was the first challenge that forced me to change my gear and to put some magic res on.
    I find difficulty very well tuned: many fights are very close and there is a sense of achievements when you win. Game also does not frustrate you, though some draws can be very, very unlucky.
  14. Baelnor

    Baelnor Kobold

    I am a bit stuck on the level 10 quests, I just get smashed. But I am not really trying too hard to pass. I just go play multiplayer
  15. Proxiehunter

    Proxiehunter Orc Soldier

    Beat both of these with an all elf party. The troggs were a close call though. Dwarves might have been better for the HP on the trogg map although the elves rapid movement helped in some spots.

    Third map for Defense of Woodhome I put my wizard and cleric on the victory squares and my warrior in front of them. Then it's just a stalling action. IIRC you get two stars before the skeletons even reach you.

    Once you have Woodhomes Wound load up on piercing attacks, armor destroying wizard spells, your own armor cards (my warrior has heavy armor. Oh no, now he's only as fast as a human! lol), and frenzies for the priest to cast on your warrior. Second trogg map I put my priest and warrior in the choke point, the troggs all came to them. My wizard blasted them from a safe position behind my warrior and priest and then when my warrior and priest fell danced around hiding in those little alcoves on the players side of the map in between blasting the two surviving troggs.
  16. Proxiehunter

    Proxiehunter Orc Soldier

    That. That has lost me SO many games.
  17. JMTron

    JMTron Kobold

    I also found the white star level difficult, but I was able to beat it on the last try. One of the difficult parts is that the kobold spear guys(?) attack from two spaces away, making it difficult for my warrior to get in close. One option is to try and quickly defeat the three kobold on the left side of the board, who come from a passage that has a 90 degree angle in it. Once you beat the three coming from that area, send your guys down that passageway. You can plant on of your guys in such a way that the only way to attack him/her is from one space away. Then you can deal with one of them at a time. If they don't take the bait, you can spam cards until you heal yourself up.
  18. Tobold

    Tobold Goblin Champion

    You probably won't have cards like Leadership yet, but your issue shows the importance of card manipulation cards. Any card that hasn't got a big effect but ends with "Draw a card" can be used to cycle through your deck faster and get the cards you need.
  19. Proxiehunter

    Proxiehunter Orc Soldier

    I think the game needs more of those. Right now all I have are a few traits and a couple Spin Around cards.
  20. Oberon

    Oberon Hydra

    With the latest build, terrain effects (lava, acid, etc.....) only apply once to a monster each turn. Meaning you can't stack firewalls under large creatures to do lots of damage any longer. I suggest players check out the large monster battles again and see how they fair.

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