[Balance] Card Discussion

Discussion in 'Card Hunter General Chat' started by Jade303, Mar 14, 2015.

  1. Flaxative

    Flaxative Party Leader Staff Member

    Because right now those cards are all okay. Changing things to be more rational is a noble goal—but in terms of doing work, it doesn't make sense when the cards you're modifying aren't problem cards. I think I explained this on page 1 or 2 of this thread :)
  2. Bluemage

    Bluemage Hydra

    Drawing cards is very powerful. Even modo in CH, where the decks are smaller than in something like Magic. Especially since the PCs can use all their cards, not like the minions in SP.

    Hey, @Flaxative, have you guys thought about cards with that as a drawback? Like an exhausting blow our something, where the PC would grey out after using the card?
    Kalin likes this.
  3. Flaxative

    Flaxative Party Leader Staff Member

    Haha that could be interesting.
  4. Jade303

    Jade303 Thaumaturge

    OK so veering off-topic here, I think that I can agree with the whole spark/fire trait thing being a thing. A thing that won't be changing even if it is a fairly good, noble thing.

    Also veering away from a new card that effectively Stuns you after you play it. As described by Bluemage. Cool.

    Cards of the Day: Illusion Wall & Illusionary Barrier
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Note that Barrier is actually a silver + on items.

    Some say Walls are too weak, some say Barriers are too strong. Who is right?
  5. karadoc

    karadoc Hydra

    I find it a bit confusing that these are two separate cards. Obviously barrier is much stronger than wall; but they are both range 8, both 3 squares, both silver; and they have similar names. I struggle to remember which is which. When I first saw Illusory Barrier I just thought that Wall Of Illusion had been buffed. I didn't realise that it was an entirely different card...

    In any case, Illusory Barrier is very strong. I wouldn't say it is too strong, but it is definitely strong. Fortunately, it doesn't win games on its own. It can be used to make the enemy waste their cards; and it can be used defensively - but it can't kill anyone on its own - and it can be removed by other terrain attachments and by cleansing. So that effectively puts a cap on how powerful it can be - and I think that's a good thing.

    Meanwhile, Wall Of Illusion is very rarely useful. The fact that it only lasts 1 turn means that it's very difficult to use it effectively. (I don't think I need to describe why it's difficult.)

    In my view, these cards should either be merged into a single duration 2 card. Or alternatively Wall Of Illusion should be tweaked so that it is more useful and less similar to Illusory Barrier. For example, it could be changed to target 1 or 2 squares instead of 3, and buffed to duration 2 or 3.
  6. gulo gulo

    gulo gulo Guild Leader

    Wall of Illusion can be helpful to replace difficult terrain in a pinch. So it's not completely useless.
    Sir Veza likes this.
  7. Deepweed

    Deepweed Thaumaturge

    Just add 1 to the duration of Wall Of Illusion, or replace Wall of Illusion with Illusory Barrier completely. Pin Of The Painful Mirage is like a lesser Phantom Pain. No one would like to use the lesser form. I generally stay away from Wall of Illusion due to it being very weak.

    Alternatively, the quality rating of Wall of Illusion can be reduced to bronze so that Pin of the Painful Mirage will be a lesser Phantom Pain but without the token cost. That would also be neat. In line with this, Wallbuilder's Staff could cost 2 minor tokens and the Maze could be replaced with Telekinesis. That would make it a viable control staff like Illusion.
    j3st3ri and doog37 like this.
  8. peonprop

    peonprop Thaumaturge

    What about making it burst 1?
  9. Jade303

    Jade303 Thaumaturge

    Making Wall of Illusion into Box of Illusion? Illusion Sphere? Illusion Burst? Sounds cool!

    I also suggested making illusion walls 5 adjacent squares. Seems like some cool ideas here.
    Youbo and Lord Feleran like this.
  10. doog37

    doog37 Hydra

    Wall of Illusion is poor because of the duration, just a Barrier is strong due to the duration. I like the burst idea, but I think that would make Wall too powerful, other than smoke bomb (which affects both teams equally and does no damage) there are no terrain attachments (usable by players) more than 3 squares. But I think there is a logic to differentiate it from Barrier... Make it function like Cleansing Presence. It gives more protection or overwriting of terrain, but since you can't target it, the extra protection is not as strong. Would still need to be duration 1 because a square of stop terrain is a lot to go through.
  11. Rebel7284

    Rebel7284 Ogre

    Wall is shinier for a weaker effect. That always annoyed me xD

    Barrier is great indeed.

    Wall is.. a cleansing that can occasionally be used to moderately annoy a wizard? Eh?
    I guess making the wall longer would help differentiate it from other cards besides being a strictly worse barrier. 4 or 5 squares would be cool.
  12. Jade303

    Jade303 Thaumaturge

    Hmm, I always think that Barriers have Stop, while Illusion Walls only stopped enemy Line of Sight. Should an Illusion really stop you from Charging straight through into an enemy wizard?

    I think that you could reduce Barrier down to duration 2, and give Wall a size increase and a duration increase to 2 but remove the Stop. That would make Wall into a smoke bomb-esque terrain that only you can see through.
  13. Deepweed

    Deepweed Thaumaturge

    Illusory Barrier is fine where it stands. Nerfing it is a bad idea to me since it already has several drawbacks to its great power (no actual damage, must need LoS to squares to block, comes in only a few items which are control-focused, etc.)

    Illusion Wall is the only card that has a problem for me, imho. Making it Burst 1 (and changing the name to Box of Illusion) sounds really neat, since you can use it to trap an enemy warrior, instantly make a protective box on your wizard, or just block opponents more. I'm just not sure that having it Burst 1 will make it have really meaningful differences over Illusory Barrier (I'd still take Illusory Barrier over it any day). You rarely have a situation that will need more than 3 squares of Illusion terrain.

    PS: When's the card of the day going to be changed?
  14. Jade303

    Jade303 Thaumaturge

    Whenever I feel like it.
    Card of the Day: Impenetrable Nimbus

    Alright, I opened up the can. You guys go at it!

    Nah, I'll post my suggestions later. Hehe.
  15. Rebel7284

    Rebel7284 Ogre

    I like nimbus. :)
    Takes skill to use it right.
    Youbo, Sir Veza and Drakkan like this.
  16. Deepweed

    Deepweed Thaumaturge

    Nimbus is fine where it stands. My only problem with it is if my opponent draws double.
    Accent, Youbo and Sir Veza like this.
  17. Flaxative

    Flaxative Party Leader Staff Member

    Re: Impenetrable Nimbus
    For whatever it's worth, there are four new warrior weapons in EttSC that have Purging Strike. Two of them are Peasant-legal; one of them has two copies; none of the four suck.

    There're also more answers to attachments being printed, all of which are "main-deckable."

    But that's enough spoilers from me—don't any of you try to get more out of me. ;)
    doog37, wavy, Maniafig and 4 others like this.
  18. Youbo

    Youbo Orc Soldier

    I think nimbus is fine as it is. While very powerful, it only last for one turn and even if you have multiple,you need priority to ensure safety.
    Paper-quality Purge get rid of it,along with other attachments.
    Personally, I prefer martyr's blessing because it last for 2 turn and nobody with half a brain attack a martyr unless they can reliably kill it really fast.
    Sir Veza likes this.
  19. Lord Feleran

    Lord Feleran Guild Leader

    I've always liked the idea behind IN and have never agreed with the ideas to make in not totally prevent all and any damage for the round unless removed/purged away.
    With Elven Maneuvers all around the place purges see a lot of play too atm but if IN proves to be too troublesome later on, its range can be lowered I guess.
    Youbo, Accent and Sir Veza like this.
  20. Bluemage

    Bluemage Hydra

    Eh, I think Nimbus is fine as it stands. It wears off every turn.
    Sir Veza likes this.

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