Saying Beneath the Frozen Earth is too hard is an understatement

Discussion in 'Feedback and Suggestions' started by Hareton, Aug 4, 2013.

  1. Hareton

    Hareton Kobold

    So I stopped playing Card Hunter not because I have enough of this game, but because developers doesn't want me to play. After 10th try I won first battle of this adventure, but second battle is many times worse. I won't grind other adventures, even though extra levels would help, it would be too long and boring. I've seen other thread about this but no satisfactory answer was given. I leave this opinion instead of just leaving, because there is still hope for improvement (difficulty balancing) in later versions. I paid 10$ but it's not completely wasted, it was after all best f2p game and best game of this genre I have ever played.
     
  2. karadoc

    karadoc Hydra

    I think I'd better unlock this module! I really enjoy a good challenge, and so if this is as difficult as you claim it is then I think it would be just my kind of thing.

    I think it's a bit weird for you to say the developers don't want you to play. That is obviously not true. What is true is that different people enjoy different levels of difficulty. Also, the module we're discussing here is an optional extra; if you are finding it so frustrating, I don't see why you don't just skip it and come back later if/when you feel like trying it again. You must understand that you are not forced to complete this module.
     
  3. Hareton

    Hareton Kobold

    I'm level 7. This is the only 7th level adventure. It is needed to get 8th level.
     
    Kilopip likes this.
  4. karadoc

    karadoc Hydra

    My mistake. Sorry. I thought you were talking about Descent to the Core, or one of the maps in that module. I got the names mixed up.

    I don't remember anything special about Beneath the Frozen Earth. I'll try it again now.
     
  5. Sir Knight

    Sir Knight Sir-ulean Dragon

    I'm glad you say you've been enjoying the game. I'm just confused when you say "no satisfactory answer was given"; if you've looked at these threads, then surely they're listing the same strategies that you used when you beat map 1. If you know how to defeat heavily-Armored enemies that like to keep you at range 2, and specifically enemies in Crude Plates, then map 2 is just the "hard mode" version of that. So do/use the same things:

    Dissolve Armor, Boiling Armor, Acid Blast, and (with caution) Wavering Faith.

    Literally anything with Penetrating, plus Impaler if appropriate.

    Step Attacks and range 2 Attacks, or longer for your Wizard.

    Anti-melee defenses, notably Parry, and of course the strategy that goes with it (guiding the enemy to attack your Armored or Block-using character first).

    Guiding the enemy movement, that is, stepping in close to enemies with Crude Plates so they back up and render themselves helpless. You can also try a crossfire at the bottom of the level to keep hitting everybody in the back.

    Managing enemy card strategy, like how if you know that the enemy has too many copies for your Dissolve Armor THIS round, then you can wait until they discard extra for the next.

    Healing, and/or just plain bringing a team with more HP.

    If you need to minimize damage from the enemy further, a little Force Bolt or a deliberate smack on the Crude Plates to make them move away.

    And if you're lucky enough to have special tools like Path Of Knives, go crazy. But don't hold your breath if you don't have that yet.

    If I've left out anything else, I'm sure someone will fill in the blanks.
     
    skip_intro and Oatmeal like this.
  6. Hareton

    Hareton Kobold

    What will it help to destroy one of their armors when next round they will deal me 20 damage? And there is nowhere to hide on 2nd battle map.
     
  7. Sir Knight

    Sir Knight Sir-ulean Dragon

    You're . . . serious. You looked at that huge list of interlocking things to reduce enemy damage (Parry, etc.), improve your own survival (Heal, etc.), and whatever mix of the two (Force Bolt, just plain killing the enemy, etc.) and decided to say the opposite so that you could feel put upon.

    Okay, I guess I'll stop talking now.
     
    Essence and skip_intro like this.
  8. Blindsight

    Blindsight Ogre

    This adventure does require you to think a little more, but it's certainly doable. Just to let you know it is possible, here is a link to my previous post on completing that map with only a single item equipped on my characters.
     
  9. karadoc

    karadoc Hydra

    I played through this map again to remind myself what it was about, and I recorded a video of it while I played. If you are interested, you can watch it here. It has all three maps, and lasts around 15 mins.

    The video might not be very helpful because the equipment I was using is probably a bit better than what newer players would have access to. So here is some general advice that comes to mind which might help:
    • Let the enemy use their move cards first. Let them come to you. This way they probably won't be able to chase you if you do decide to move away, and they won't be able to flee from you if you decide you want to move in closer.
    • If you draw some good armour / block cards, try to position your characters so that the enemies use all of their attacks against your strongest defenders.
    • If you don't draw any good cards, just try to stay out of their attack range until the next round.
    • Generally focus on taking out one enemy at a time; because if you can kill one of them, then they'll have fewer cards and fewer attacks to use against you on the next turn. This is particularly important on the final map of this module, because they will have quite a lot of cards to use against you until you start killing them.

    Actually, that advice is general enough to apply to pretty much every module. I hope it's at least a little bit helpful.

    --

    In terms of the difficulty of the game and the game's design, for my own sake I hope that the game isn't made easier. Because as I've said, I really enjoy a good challenge. But I do think it's generally a good thing when there are multiple paths such that players can skip the most difficult levels and come back to them later. Card Hunter has multiple paths like that for most of the game, but there are a few bottleneck modules. Perhaps when more modules are created there will be more pathways; but on the other hand, compulsory modules are probably very useful for the progression of the main story arc of the game.
     
  10. Wozarg

    Wozarg Thaumaturge

    This adventure is a shadow of its former self after the nerf. Visit the shop and get a few 5 gold equipment of the appropriate type and you should beat it within 3 tries for sure.
     
    skip_intro likes this.
  11. Kalin

    Kalin Begat G'zok

    Can you skip it and come back later? I had Compass of Xorr unlocked before I tried Frozen Earth.
     
  12. Essence

    Essence Orc Soldier

    I honestly didn't even notice this adventure. It wasn't even a bump in the road. I know what party I used, because I didn't customize anything for anything until I hit Descent Into the Core. I beat this, within three tries, with a Step/Penetrating Warrior, a Spark Wizard, and a Frenzy Cleric. IIRC, Unholy Frenzy + Blind Rage + various Lunges took them down pretty easily. Pelted them with sparks on the way in, put Warrior up front; when they stepped up to spear range, he Lunged in and then spammed Penetrating Cuts (I think by then I had around 9 in my deck). Cleric spammed Inspiration to keep the Warrior attacking long after the Trogs had run out of actions for the round.

    All Humans, BTW.
     
  13. Hareton

    Hareton Kobold

    I didn't have anything better to do and I grinded a bit for better equip. With it I completed the mission, it wasn't even hard anymore. I didn't expect that few cards would make so much difference. Also I learned about usefulness of movement and attack cards, they allow to outmaneuver the enemy and attack from behind. Tactical depth of this game is greater than I thought and actually fun, diffrently than in most games of that type, where it is slow, boring and worthless. I'm glad to play it more, though it's very bad news about reset after beta.

    Nontheless, this mission require too much from new players, and many won't be so eager to try dozen of times. Maybe there should be more hints in game how to complete it.
     
    Pengw1n likes this.
  14. Wozarg

    Wozarg Thaumaturge

    The games early content has been completely overnerfed already take my word for it that if they nerf it more the real diehard fans will hate it and people who give up right away will be screwed around lvl 15 anyway so who needs them?
     
    skip_intro likes this.
  15. Gerry Quinn

    Gerry Quinn Goblin Champion

    I'm pretty sure I used Penetration only on this mission, I never used armour dissolving of any sort until much later. Don't remember it as being too hard. Though if I remember correctly the last scenario of this campaign was a memorable one in which you started at the middle and had to fight three groups of trogs in turn. For the last group I had to sacrifice my warrior and retreat my wizard and priest up a tunnel, and fortunately the AI sent three trogs up the tunnel (all difficult terrain, so they were crawling along taking spells to the face) and only one went around to flank me.

    I think with this game, you need to realise that on a hard mission you can tweak your deck, and tweak your strategy, and keep on getting a little better tactically, but you may also need a decent draw to win. I suspect some players may get discouraged when they have a strategy that is okay or the best they can think of, but get a bad draw and then don't know where they are, or conclude the game is impossible. If you think your strategy was workable, but the cards just didn't come, don't change anything, just try again with the same decks (and keep on watching for ways to make your tactics better turn by turn).
     
  16. doog37

    doog37 Hydra

    I actually remember liking this mission as it was the first I didn't finish on the first try. Forced me to customize my build for the first time and tweaking your build will be important from this point forward. The difficulty of certain missions solely comes from enemies with specific armors that give them immunity to certain types of attacks (e.g. Skeletons and Only Bones).
    Glad you made it through and dont forget to check out the regular shop(s) once in a while it changes daily and for a small price you can pick up an item or 2 that can make you much better.

    Good luck with the Chess Board levels... oh snap this was posted a year ago... wasting my breath.
     

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