Hello! This post intends to deal with what, in my opinion, is the current sad state of the card Barge. I've been playing the game for a few weeks now, and decided that this unfortunate card could use a friend to help it reach its full potential. First, I just want to take a minute to thank anyone at BM who might be reading this post. Your game is really something special, and I can't wait for it to go live. --------------- The Problem: --------------- Why is Barge a bad card? It isn't, it would be a great card to be paired with low level (1-9) items, but just does not stand up with its peers at its level range. Card Hunter is certainly a game about positioning, which leads to very cerebral, exciting matches between two players trying to find an opening in their opponent's defenses. To that end, the two roles which warriors seem to fit well are that of strikers, who overwhelm poorly armored teams or low health teams with heavily damaging or penetrating attacks, or that of skirmishers, who overwhelm poorly mobile teams or highly blocking-dependent teams with a balance of agility and damage. There are certainly more ways to play a warrior than this, and I encourage people to play what they find fun, but most games of multiplayer exhibit either strikers or skirmishers. Unfortunately, Barge doesn't have a place in either of these strategies with level 18 characters. While the ability to push a target two squares might be appealing when combined with the high power of encumber and lava effects, the lack of damage attached to Barge makes it a poor candidate for a striker, and the lack of a step feature makes it a poor candidate for a skirmisher. Barge just can't stand up with the other cards at its supposed power level, consider these three level 18 warrior weapons: Bejeweled Shortsword Barbarian's Club Barreling Club Trading copies of Vicious Thrust with Barge is just a bad choice. And while I am aware that Vicious Thrust is currently a bit too strong for its rarity, even trading copies of Dancing Cut with Barge is a bad choice. While I don't believe that all of an item's merits should stem from its rarity, I think it is pretty clear that the addition of Barge brings down the usefulness of the cards to which it is attached. ------------------ My Suggestions: ------------------ There are a few opportunities for change which I think could turn Barge into a more useful and more played card. 1: Add "Step 2" to the card. This would allow Barge to allow warriors to bring more mobility into their decks without resulting in a two step "bomb" like Vicious Thrust. This change would also fit the flavor of the card, a warrior using his momentum and strength to throw an opponent bodily. 2: Increase the damage of the card. While I think a case could be made for an increase to 8 damage given the high damage output of cards like Powerful Hack, if Barge dished out even something like 4-6 damage it could certainly have more uses in a warrior's deck. 3: Increase the push distance of the card. This option is unfortunately less solid, given that increasing the push distance beyond a certain threshold does little to add improved functionality to the card. Still, a push distance of 4-6 could certainly be effective in moving an opponent's troops into vulnerable positions, or in throwing that encumbered dwarf far, far away from your mage. The best solution would likely be a combination of suggestions 1 and 2. Ideally, I think that Barge could have a reasonable place in multiplayer if it gained "step 2" and a damage increase to 4, or if it gained "step 1" and a damage increase to 6. ----- Thanks for reading; let me know what you think!
It seems as though you're confusing the card, to the card's placement on items. Both my priest and wizard, for instance, love to use Barge (sadly it's often parried!!) even at high levels. Certainly it's on a lot of weapons and warrior items, but it's not just a warrior card. However, even focusing on warrior cards, if you want to play a positioning game it's a great utility card to be able to push someone where you want then step attack them, or get someone out of the way so you can run past them to your prime target. Sure it's not the same a dealing damage, it's pretty much pure utility which is actually something I'm happy to see the warriors have. They have very few other utility cards and I feel like Barge is decently suited for the type of gameplay that is offered in CH. I will say that, for the power, it being silver rarity might be a bit much because as you suggest, it doesn't live up to the level of other silver cards.
I agree that Barge doesn't really live up to its silver rating. It's a weaker card than Telekinesis, which is bronze. I'm a bit unsure about your options for buffing it though. 1) I thought adding "step 2" to it sounded like a really good idea until I realised this would make it essentially the same as Muscle Through. Even so, Barge would be made a lot more powerful and versatile if it just had step 1. That alone might make it worthy of it's silver status. (But I'd still generally prefer to have Vicious Thrust!) 2) Increasing the damage would remove the utility value of being able to use it on one's own teammates, and I think this would make it a less interesting card. (It would become a strange version of a bash card.) 3) ... Well, I don't think there's anything really bad about this suggestion - but it might seem a bit strange to be able to shove a character so far without any kind of 'magic'. (ie. physically shoving someone so that they move further than they could run in one turn seems strange.)
Two good posts! I agree, Blindsight, and I hope I made it clear that I do think Barge is a card very much in the "spirit" of CH, but really lacks in effectiveness compared to other cards at its level category. Karadoc, your point about Muscle Through is certainly valid. Adding step 2 may be an overreach, but I really think that we need some more step 2 cards rather than just Vicious Thrust, and certainly more step 2 cards at lower rarity levels. Increasing the damage would, yes, make the card more like a bash card, but I'm not sure that is necessarily a bad idea. And yes, throwing an opponent 4+ squares would certainly be a...spectacle. It occurs to me now that Barge could also perhaps be improved with the addition of a a "knocked prone" flavor, wherein it could force an opponent to discard movement cards (as opposed to a "halt 1" effect which would be very powerful).
A simple "Discard Oldest" would still be pretty flavorful, and make the card worth considering over damaging and positioning choices. Can then be a way for a Warrior on the run to not only get an approaching enemy warrior off of him, but also possibly remove the intended follow-up attack. Or when on the offense, you can Barge away some armor, at the cost of then having to chase your target with a Step move. However, both discard oldest and discard move REALLY restrict the ability to use this to move your own characters (Discard oldest more than discard move, since you will often have used your move before the push anyway). 1 damage Push is quite nice to get a Halt/Encumber ally off Lava.
Barge could have some sort of passive bonus while it's sitting in hand, it could be as simple as "+2 to bash attacks, keep" to fit in a bash themed deck. I don't think a "frenzy 1 keep"or "Hard to Block 1 keep" would be OP either, it would change the card somewhat as it would be revealed upon playing attacks and you'd lose the element of surprise.
I think that Xienwolf and Generica both present good ideas. If the designers want to move Barge in a more aggressive direction, the advantage gained from "discard oldest" would certainly make up for the lack of range, step, and damage. There's nothing like losing that one card that you were counting on to put you at a disadvantage. The notion of adding a passive bonus is also very intriguing, but I think that given the already high amount of +damage buffs, perhaps something along the lines of "you may ignore encumbering effects" or "you may resist forced movement" could make Barge a card that you would be much happier to draw in the current climate of Frost Jolt and Whirlwind. Perhaps this could rely on a die roll, such as that required for Dodge. It also occurs to me that Barge could be boosted by converting it into a cantrip. It would be the first attack cantrip that I'm aware of, but would certainly allow the ability to be both useful when used against both allies and enemies. A similar, but much more significant change, would be to add "draw a card" to Barge, which could I think be considered if Barge was boosted to gold from silver.
I have Bynzer's Weighted Club in my inventory, so anything that would improve Barge would certainly make me think about using it. This item is the only Legendary I have ever considered selling as it is fairly useless as it stands.
I agree with the OP, I've never understood the point of using Barge. I mean I get what it's good for, it just does not do its job very effectively. and this, instead of a good attack card on a weapon? no thank you. Anyway I think one of its intentions is that you can use it on allies too. That's why a higher damage or "discard oldest" would actually limit its usefulness. I would probably just make it less rare and include it on items with more variety (on many different kinds of items). A weapon with good attacks with 1 or 2 additional Barges would be great. (don't give me Barge instead of good attacks, please.) Also a shield, or boots, or armor, or whatever, with a Barge (as a less rare card): sounds great to me! But the way it appears on items now....... meh.
I simply rate barge lower than the weakest bash card. Sure you can move them where you want and a extra square but this card is just something i get on items i want not something i would ever look for.
