(Question) Opinions on Temple of Terror Map 3 ?

Hi everyone, I'm wondering what the general opinion of map 3 in the temple of terror is like. There used to be 3 war monkeys as can be seen in Zalminen and Pengw1n's playthroughs, which has been buffed to 5 in its current iteration (almost all the war monkey maps were buffed I think).

I had a lot of trouble dealing with them due to their high mobility and card draw (1 per member, right ?) as well as their excellent defensive skills (Acrobatic Leap and Duck). Trying to sprint to the bridge and blockading them there doesn't work since there are 2 already on your side of the bridge and being flanked from behind by them is absolutely deadly (card theft and +6 damage). Trying to separate them to avoid being focus fired doesn't work well either due to the above reason.

I tried wedging my party into the small hole where you start (2 in front and 1 behind and then cycling them whenever possible to spread the damage) to avoid the backstabs but that didn't work out so well either (turns out there are just enough war monkeys to completely surround you in that state). After the initial opening burst from a fresh hand, I found it pretty common for half/a third of all attacks in a turn being completely neutralised by acrobatic leap/duck while the party is inevitably worn down by Pickpocket, acid tiles, etc. Magma tiles and acid tiles don't work very well on them, they have plenty of mobility and will almost always have some spare when your party is doing a hold-your-ground strategy. Besides, with acrobatic leap it's more likely that your party ends up on those tiles instead.

As for my party, they're 17+ (Temple is recommended for 16 I think ?) and they seem more talent limited than gear limited. I packed as much armor as I could gather and as many parries as I could to block their attacks and generate card draw. Is there something I'm missing ?

Edit: I know path of knives would be great but it's pretty rare (haven't seen any copies yet anywhere) and perhaps whirlwind enemies (I have 1 copy) but if the encounter can only be beaten by cramming one or two card types it seems rather cheesy. Also, wall of illusions exploit doesn't count.

 

After 8 more tries I think I got the crux of issue. The fairly open layout of map 3 and the increased number of WMs make it pretty tricky for either strategy (kiting vs tanking) imo. Kiting is tough due to the WMs' Scamper, which provides decent "free" movement and is common enough with the card that gives them a chance to draw when targeted. Getting caught in a bad position means your back is exposed and that is a quick slide to failure.

Tanking is tougher compared to the 2 maps before it as there aren't any tight corridors to limit the number of WMs in contact with your party. The WMs do decent damage and it's likely there will be enough attack cards for all of them with their card draw mechanic since one would be frantically attacking them. Another factor might be that damage tends to get dispersed among multiple WMs when attack cards are used to ensure that backs aren't exposed (even with your back against the wall, it is occasionally exposed when buffing/healing, etc)

The key, as you have mentioned, appears to be limiting the number of WMs in contact with your characters or disrupting their hands. In my last try, a lucky opening where the WMs had only one move card and a wall of stone on my side made it possible to blockage the bridge. With only 4 WMs at once (for two turns), the encounter became more manageable and I could see why they made it 5 to simulate a strong challenge. I'm not sure why the difference between 4 and 5 was so drastic though.

I wonder if it's intentional to try and push players out of builds they are more comfortable with. Frost spells just begin to appear on items at that level range I think (15+ and above)? I would say it's definitely the most challenging map I've encountered so far.

PS. kudos to the dev team ! As someone whose neighbourhood is occasionally harassed by wild monkeys, I would say the WMs capture the flavour of a monkey attack really well.

 

I currently have no clue how to beat this level, i have only a single frost spell and not many walls (only 2 illusionary).
And getting a 14 dmg attack ducked and returned with its own turn is quite frustrating.

 

Lots and lots of movement. Monkeys rarely attack from the front, instead they move if possible and expose their back. Even if they attack from the front, most attacks aren't that bad. And never ever play 14 dmg attack when it can be ducked. That's what Weak Chop and similar or for. Although Acrobatic Flip can also be annoying, so usually you have to wait that atleast one monkey has already attacked. That way he can't backstab you even if Flip succeeds.

Oh, and losing one or two guys isn't necesserily end of the world, avoiding monkeys is lot easier with fewer characters.

Then again, I think it was only adventure I had to restart twice.

 

I'm usally using 2 or 3 of those on my warrior http://wiki.cardhuntria.com/wiki/Items/Blocking_Mace . So the key is just positioning. Once you have a powerfull attack card on your hand you can use your priest or mage to turn one monkey arround so the warrior can use it with beeing blocked. Also very usefull are attacks that are hard to block. I think there is one divine weapon with some of them in the starter pack. But even with this strategy this maps seems to be very hard.

 

It was smooth sailing for my party for the last few encounters till the 3rd map of this level. I think what stuck out to me wasn't necessarily how hard the 3rd map was by itself, but rather how difficult it was in comparison to the other monkey maps so far. The others were challenging - I was able to complete them without having to restart, but the matches were generally very close - but this map has been very difficult.

I've only played the map once, so I'm going to tinker with my guys' equipment and see if this is where I finally need to start tailoring my loadout to the encounter.

I tried a different strategy each of my 3 attempts. The first time, I generally didn't have a strategy, and that failure could likely be chocked up to unfamiliarity with the encounter. The second time I was lucky enough to draw a wall of stone on my initial hand, and I blocked off the bridge on the 2nd turn (couldn't get in range for the first turn). That helped delay the two larger guys, but the mobility and backstab was too much for my party to handle. This inspired me, on the third attempt, to cluster my party in the back corner. I feel that's a solid strategy to deal with the first 5 monkeys as it all but negates their backstabs. Maybe once I gain a level or two, or after tweaking my loadout I'll be able to actually kill all 5 monkeys. Then I'll just have to deal with the two big guys, but somehow I don't think they'll be so tough once the group of 5 is taken out.

I'll post more or edit this when I've tried it some more, but for now I agree with the others that this map does definitely stand out in terms of difficulty.


Edit: Just tried it again with the same party, albeit at level 17 instead of level 16 this time, and I was able to finish it. It was tough, but I managed to get my guys in the corner and kill of the first 5 monkeys without losing anyone. I lost two others killing the last two guys, but my dwarven priest is boss - so he took care of them

 

Wow! This was the most challenging battle of the game for me so far. It was comforting to hear that the challenge level had been increased. It must have taken me 5 or 6 tries to complete this with my level 16 party.

I agree that the challenge is largely due to the war monkeys' card draw. Between drawing 5 per round to start, and the card draw off of Simian Reflexes, AND considering that none of their attacks do less than 5 damage (I think). Of course, if they were easier to kill, this wouldn't be as much of an issue, but they have high hit points, and those blocks are just crazy. Oh, and they have armor, too!

I agree the key to success is avoiding backstabs, getting a few blocks of your own, and high damage output. I was using mulitple Slicer traits, with chop cards, which are great for hitting multiple monkeys at once!

 

I've noticed the difficulty ramping up around this stage of the campaign, which is good. But I've been stuck on this level for more than a day now. I've already revamped my gear more than once, and after my latest fail (and coming nowhere close to winning yet), I've got to completely customize my gear for this challenge. At least now I can save my "monkeyfied" gear set for future WM levels.

 

Giving up on this one for the time being. Even with monkeyfied gear, the best I've done is kill 2 WMs. By turn 3, I'm simply overwhelmed by the sheer number of cards they have.

 

Yeah, this map is making me feel like an idiot. I simply can't complete it with my lvl 18 party, regardless of their gear selection. 5 War Monkeys in a single group scampering every round means that I just can't protect all 3 backs. Forget about the Mantis and Zaius, I'm usually gutted before they even get into the mix.

 

I know the feeling. All my hatred for this map. Still haven't been able to get past it, and it's not for a lack of trying.

 

Has anyone considered starting a strategy guide for the game?

IIRC, when I eventually got past this map, some of the key strategies were:

• Keep your party clustered together to minimize exposure to attacks
• Cards that allow you to reposition enemies are extremely helpful
  • Acrobatic Flip Allows you to change your facing AND an enemy's facing (great for setting up an attack to bypass their blocks)
  • Whirlwind Enemies or, less ideally, Whirlwind can be a life-saving reset when you're feeling swarmed (though it can backfire)
  • Barge can also be useful.
• High damage cards are essential. A warrior with Slicer, Strong Chop, Obliterating Chop can take out several Simians simultaneously, or at least wound them to the point where they break off the attack.
• For your mage, I recommend an electric build. A lot of the bolt cards are hard to block, which is helpful.
• Finally, make sure your priest is also capable of dealing some damage. Cards that steal HP are helpful here (e.g., Spear Of Darkness, Invigorating Touch)

Hope this helps! This was definitely the toughest battle of the game for me.

 

I find this battle very unbalanced. Between the sheer number of monkeys, their blocks, agility, and the damage that they deal - I just keep dying. I've changed my deck to try and block more, put up walls of fire/arcane, push-back, and heal with my attacks, but I'm getting nowhere. I've enjoyed the game thoroughly, however this battle has agitated me to the point of coming on here and posting about it. I think that if there were less of the blocks in the monkey hand or if the blocks had a higher chance of failure (which I feel would be fair for the sheer amount and the perks that they bring) then this battle would feel more leveled. I find the enemies having 3 or more blocks in their hand regularly - which has me wanting to throw my keyboard.

 

If you have the reserve characters for it, I'd recommend not using warriors for this fight since that gets rid of most of their blocks, leaving you only Duck to contend with.

Next you can exploit the fact that the war monkey AI will never walk onto a damaging terrain square to reduce the exposition of your characters. Wall Of Fire is ideal for this, like so:



With only one Wall Of Fire, you can reduce the number of squares they can attack from to 2. They also can't attack you from the back with this setup, just ignore my red mage facing the wrong way.

Keep holding at least one further Wall Of Fire to make sure you can renew it, but if you have extras you can close their access completely. Once Zaius (boss) gets in range, focus your attacks on him since he can attack 2 squares away. Whirlwind Ennemies is extra useful since you're in a corner, and it can help if the war monkeys reach you on turn 1.

If you're using a warrior with this setup, just don't melee as long as the monkeys overwhelm you, they'll Acrobatic Flip him onto lava and jump in his place.

You can do this with common items available from the shops: Blister Stone, Burning Bangle, Charged Opal, Wand Of Hot Winds, etc. For uncommons, Greenstone Pendant, Glowing Jewel and similar are available from shops as well.

 

Nirvana - That's an amazing strategy! I can't believe that I didn't think to do something like that. I only have one Wizard that is currently high enough level, but I've been leveling up a second group in case I needed a stand in like that.

I'm going to go and load up on Firewalls now and give it another shot to see if I can do it with just one Wizard - then adjust if needed. Thanks so much for the help, it's very much appreciated!

 

This level is wayyyyy too difficult. I have probably gone through 60 gold and 15 attempts at this point. I have tried all the advice above but am unable to take down more than three of the monkeys.

The combination of two really good block rolls that both have side affects (move you, or take your card(!!!)) makes them difficult to hit. Then they have armor. In addition every attack they have is high in value and difficult to block or prevent damage. They have a huge hand and cycle through cards quickly as well (Simian reflexes).

Given what I mentioned above, 5 monkeys is almost unstoppable. Like I said, I've only been able to take down 3 max before my whole party falls.

 

Since there has been so much talk about this lately I went back and played the map last night. I went in with a stock Warrior(Human)/Wizard(Elf)/Priest(Human) party all using a mediocre single player deck of mostly common and uncommon items with only a couple rares spread across the entire party. It was just whatever items I had pulled out of completing the previous adventures.

My first time through I lost because I made a couple critical mistakes (played my move cards both wrong and too early and got myself surrounded). I still had both replays available, though, so I just went at it again and walked all over the monkeys. Got out of there with two of my three characters still intact, both at over half health (wizard was only hit by a couple Dissolve Armor cards from the hell mantis). It's challenging, sure, but... it's more daunting than difficult. It looks hard. It looks really hard. And I think that initial perception colors a person's playthrough of the level more than the actual difficulty.

For the record, I simply split the monkeys in two. Not with Chop cards, although those might have helped. No, I used bait. Sent my warrior straight at one of the monkeys that was already across the bridge, sent my priest straight at the other. A single monkey is no challenge at all, and both predictably scampered straight up to my melee characters. I diverted my wizard to back up the warrior and the two of them tore that single monkey to shreds, while my Priest waited for his monkey to waste his attack and then smacked him about. Next turn, sent wizard to aid priest in finishing off his monkey while I tempted other three to go after my warrior. Over the next two turns I eliminated the three remaining monkeys one at a time with attacks at their back from my wizard and priest (and occasionally warrior if they turned their back on him).

Then I focused down the monkey master (losing my warrior in the process) leaving only a hell mantis that stood no chance against my wizard and priest and was down in two more turns.

Challenging, but certainly not too hard.

If you don't see it up there, here's the tip: single monkeys pose no challenge. Use two characters to focus down the monkeys one at a time; preferably one character to either side of them, constantly hitting their backs to avoid those infuriating block cards they have. Even if a character has three monkeys on them, just focus on stopping one at a time. War Monkeys don't have particularly strong attacks unless you're careless and give them yours, or you let them get behind you easily. Use your move cards intelligently and you can significantly neuter their offense.

 

Killing monkeys one at a time is not even an option most the time. It's entirely dependent on the luck of the draw. They draw 7 out of 20 on first turn, they'll often have 2 or 3 Scamper in that opening hand. Dealing enough damage before all 5 monkeys flood all over you is also entirely luck.

"Not letting them get behind you" is mostly luck of the draw as well. All their move cards are free move; if they draw more than you at the wrong time they will surround you unless you're hugging a corner.