Card Hunter Club feedback

Discussion in 'Feedback and Suggestions' started by Sir Knight, Apr 18, 2013.

  1. Sir Knight

    Sir Knight Sir-ulean Dragon

    So, now we have the Card Hunter Club. We've got feedback going in that announcement thread, but I figured having a named thread over here couldn't hurt.

    My thoughts:

    Alright, now we have a "subscription service." What's the impact? On a typical map, where you get two items in your treasure chest, the Club grants you a third. This is reminiscent of the Treasure Hunt pattern: you have two normal adventures at each level, plus a unique third one that costs money. Only by paying money can you get the extra loot per day of the third one.

    The Club, though, requires less "work" than playing an entire extra adventure: it's always there. And, importantly, your extra Club loot is guaranteed to be as rare as the best-rarity item you get in regular loot. That's much better than a Treasure Hunt.

    And, if Zalminen doesn't mind, I'll just repost this:
    For me, a real kicker is that the "Triumphant Noise!" for loot above Common rarity is very likely to play. So you're required to sit through 150% of the total loot animation time (remember: three items instead of the two before this update), then hear a "Triumphant Noise!", and then still be unable to collect the item.

    By all the feedback so far, I think we're arguing for toning down the "rubbing it in your face after every fight" factor. If it just sat there, unassuming, for non-members then it might be fine. No being forced to wait through 150% of the animation time; no sound effect; maybe even no card suite popup display. And all of these pretty things would be unlocked as soon as you buy the key, so Club members would enjoy the experience.

    Different but related thought:

    I'd argue that the "guaranteed rarity" thing is more of an edge than necessary. I'm sure it will engender complaints about "paying for an advantage." And hey, if that were thrown out, then the persistent "Triumphant Noise!" would play less often and it would be less of a tease (without need for changing more complex code, as the other suggestions would demand).
     
  2. Pengw1n

    Pengw1n Moderately Informed Staff Member

    I can see an issue with loot rarity from the membership - getting 2 legendaries instead of 1 is a bit much isn't it. Maybe have the club offer an uncommon+ item, or an item 1 step below highest rarity in the chest. Then again, it makes sense in terms of making people spend money on the game. It's getting close to the line however as is.

    Edit: since it's "guaranteed" items only, it's not as much of an issue. However, double epics from premiums is the closest situation to the described above.
     
  3. Wozarg

    Wozarg Thaumaturge

    My two main peeves is the current price ( all content of beta subject to change) and the rubbing it in your face. While it is optional since the game it self is free its a pretty big bonus right now that will be massively impactful for the launch of the game pushing people with "subscription" far ahead after just 3 pvp chests and a few adventures. Also as stated by sir knight the bonus of getting the same value or higher is very big just imagine if you find the first legendary on the server if you where a member of the club you now found the two first legendary items that is a massive deal.

    My personal way of making this better in my opinion would be this. Firstly cut the price by about 50% 10$ is a decent cut of money every month of some people 5$ is more reasonable and thereby making it less of a exclusive "rich boy" club and more of a paid membership deal. Secondly i would make the reward always uncommon or better but not reliant on the best thing you got(are guaranteed). So if you have bad luck and get lots of commons your loot curve will spike in quality and it would still be able to roll better rarity just not default to it based on your other loot and also no double legendary silliness. That would make it more fairly priced for more people hence getting more sales while at the same time making the rewards much more fair. People will cry either way but most reasonable people will not care about a smoother loot curves with slightly more items as much as they will about big rarity spikes.

    Edit
    If i keep this up i can join the screeds soon!

    Missed that part pengw1n then I'm actually much more fine with the loot model if they remove this working for epics from premium adventures.
     
  4. SurgeonFish

    SurgeonFish Automaton Moderator Staff Member

    Not to interrupt your conversation but.


    I called it =p
     
  5. Sir Knight

    Sir Knight Sir-ulean Dragon

    Wait. Hmm.

    Okay, so with the current setup, it IS possible to draw a lower-rarity "Club item" than your regular items? If you play a normal adventure and are lucky enough to win two Legendary items, your "Club item" could still be a Common? Then the language there could use improvement.

    So as it is now, the "Club bonus" means you get "one more guaranteed Rare item" (or whatever) out of every Treasure Hunt, Quest, and special "multiplayer win chest."

    I'm thinking about this, and something seems out-of-balance. I would still argue that removing the minimum rarity entirely would be better.
     
  6. Pengw1n

    Pengw1n Moderately Informed Staff Member

    Yeah, removing guaranteed rarity and just have it be an extra random item (possibly uncommon+) would clear up any confusion and potential op loot (premiums and dungeons that has set treasures of high rarities et c).
     
    Wozarg likes this.
  7. Wozarg

    Wozarg Thaumaturge

    I really feel uncommon+ only would be so much better and make it feel worthwhile but also fair.
     
  8. irongamer

    irongamer Orc Soldier

    I'm curious how this plays out.

    Most f2p models I've experienced don't give any weight to the "work" it takes for non-subscribers. Any argument around "fairness", "time invested", or "work" dealing with subscription pretty much flies out the window (if it was ever really considered) by release. Subscribers always get more for less "work", period. Planetside 2 is a current example. They have adjusted some things but it is still an insane grind to diversify your gear if you are not subscribed.
     
  9. SurgeonFish

    SurgeonFish Automaton Moderator Staff Member

    Being familiar with the planetside 2 model things are slightly different. You can buy your different gear, but the certs are what make the difference as they increase your power. Their subscribers can increase their rate of certs with a sub, but all characters are capable at level 1 to be great.

    Its a little different here as you need to grow to be stronger in level and can't beat down adragon at level 1 (unless you are insally awesome, now I wana see someone try). Allowing for more loot to drop each chest would be hastening the curve as expected. While at first I didn't know what to think. Milling over it I think its an approprate system.

    Honestly though I expected a few more subscriber rewards though. That's just me.
     
  10. irongamer

    irongamer Orc Soldier

    That increased cert rate makes all the difference in the world. Diversity is power. Access to weapons to kill specific vehicles is key when you running with a big outfit. I don't see much difference from my experience. The f2p model is really just a demo without a subscription.

    In the case of Planetside 2 non-subscribers are fodder until they are given enough time to catch up.
     
  11. SurgeonFish

    SurgeonFish Automaton Moderator Staff Member

    I could argue that point, but we are here to play card hunter.

    As a side note

    [​IMG]

    Ive played too much planetside 2
     
  12. Kodi

    Kodi Orc Soldier

    Hmmm I'm ok with the club but I don't like the " HEY! Look this item you can get if you give us more money" every single time! (pretty much the same thing that annoys the most of us) I'm ok with the rubbing in your face, but cmon! every time? Drop it to the first and final chest of the adventure and I'm happy (or maybe only in the last chest)
     
  13. Dark Wolfe

    Dark Wolfe Orc Soldier

    I think we could do without the item drop-in and noises when not in the club, but if hovering doesn't show the cards how do we know what we are missing out on? maybe right-click to pull it up, but that requires situational contexts
     
  14. Zalminen

    Zalminen Hydra

    Yeah, I did consider starting a new thread about this but wasn't sure if others shared my concerns.

    Maybe the hover could show just the item name and rarity for the club reward? That way if you're curious and already on the fence about joining you can still look the item up in the wiki.
    The actual cards are the one thing I really wouldn't want to get dangled in my face every time...

    Heh, I probably wouldn't even care if this was some average game but Card Hunter is just so damn awesome and this is pretty much the only bad decision they've made so far :)
     
  15. Pengw1n

    Pengw1n Moderately Informed Staff Member

    Yeah, this is the first veer into P2W territory - as it affects every drop in the game. I understand it from a financial standpoint, as I have been wondering how BM would make enough money from the game - but it's a bit in your face as described. Having the extra item appear under a frosted cloche et c would feel better in that regard. Also, pricing might be a bit much, considering this is an ongoing fee rather than a one time cost.
     
  16. SurgeonFish

    SurgeonFish Automaton Moderator Staff Member

    My 2 cents squished down into short sentences

    I don't think being able to see member rewards while not being a member is annoying. Just ignore it.

    I still don't feel its pay to win because the reward is still completely random.
     
    LightPhoenix likes this.
  17. Wozarg

    Wozarg Thaumaturge

    Currently unless something changed it is not completely random if it was i would have no P2W concerns about it. You gain the highest rarity guaranteed which means every quest pvp bonus chest and extra adventure reward is a extra rare or better and that adds up fast over a few days.
     
  18. SurgeonFish

    SurgeonFish Automaton Moderator Staff Member

    Which is completely random in what you get. You don't pick an item. The system does it for you.
     
  19. Pengw1n

    Pengw1n Moderately Informed Staff Member

    Exactly, not too bothered with an extra reward - bothered with extra guaranteed loot. That will be insane from pvp chests!
     
  20. Pengw1n

    Pengw1n Moderately Informed Staff Member

    Rarity isn't random for any chests with guaranteed rarity drops which makes it p2w for pvp reward chests.
     

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