[SUGGESTION] "GM/AI opponents only" mode for MP (with reduced rewards)

To toss out yet another wacky idea for which I bear zero responsibility implementing or even contributing to a technical design document , one could imagine encouraging ad-hoc co-op through an ongoing event -- say, pick a map or set of it, have a survival-style co-op mode on it (increasingly large waves of enemies on it), keep track of a total number of enemies killed by the community as a whole, offer a reward to participants if a certain threshold is met before the event is over.

Endless has some interesting possibilities, especially if the dungeon got progressively harder and at the end of each wave the group needed to decide whether to accept only "intermediate wave" rewards (two-item chest, no XP) and keep going in hopes of more XP and more rewards, or to finish and collect a better reward depending on how far they got. Decisions, decisions...

I might say that I don't really look forward to playing co-op until there are more communications methods built-in (ideally voice, some ability to highlight card suggestions or tiles). One could set up out-of-band communications, I suppose, but built-in would be neat.

 

There already is Quick Draw PvE, the AI already exists (at least for one battle). One of the battles in one of the adventures of the EttSC expansion is a Quick Draw one.

 

Awesome, I should buy that.

 

Worth noting that in that battle the AI isn't playing QD, it's got static monsters and the player is playing QD versus them. But yeah you can QD versus Gary (make any casual map, set 3 spawn points per side, then host with AI opponent and no monsters set with the quickDraw scenario tag). Gary's ... really, really, hilariously, bad at QD. To the point where if you enjoy playing QD against him you're probably the kind of person who thinks squishing ants is the pinnacle of joy. =)

 

Hmm, yeah, that inevitably leads to the thought that maybe the suggestion presented by this thread is pretty ill-considered.
Considering
a) creating a competent AI is extremely hard and expensive
b) the AI in Card Hunter is no great shakes
c) to be successful the AI-only MP would need a reasonably competent AI, able to handle all the different teams and item builds we'd want to have it use
one cannot but arrive at the conclusion that such a mode is a pipe dream.

In the adventures the game currently offers the weaknesses of the AI can be compensated for by the number and HP count of the various monsters and their efficient, thin decks and by map design. This is true also for a well-designed (near)endless dungeon mode. For an AI MP random team mode, not so much.

I guess using similarly boosted 3-character AI teams (thin decks with enhanced cards, more HP) could work to an extent but probably the inherent AI limitations would soon become too obvious to ignore. I fear it would soon devolve into the ant-squishing category which would probably not satisfy anyone for any length of time. Thanks for making me see that, Flaxative! It's a bit painful but ultimately useful and necessary to realize these things.

 

I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand. Cardotron is easy to cheese if you build specifically for Cardotron, but in theory if we had a diversity of "broken tier" AI opponents, and randomized them, this mode could still be somewhat interesting. I don't think the mandate is for the AI to simulate human players, anyway.

 

Good points. Glad to hear the mode then has a theoretical chance .

 

I would love to implement an AI. If there would be something like the Robocode or another usable API, I would enjoy writing an AI much more than playing cardhunter. The good old days with robocode tournaments ...

 

Maybe this is an old thread, but I do think the idea has merit. Even the quick draw idea. Obviously nothing is going to equal a human opponent, but just having the option of testing out builds, getting a feel for how MP works (similar as to how you fight Gary for the first few matches of your MP career), and getting some reward for it definitely seems like something I'd want to partake in, and would add a degree of randomness to...let's face it...a fairly static and predictable SP experience right now.

As for quick draw? Well yes, Gary is hilariously bad at it, but who says he has to play by the same rules as us? Just pre-arrange about a dozen seven-card deck variations he can work well with and have his characters get them randomly assigned.

Also, having several overpowered AI similar to Cardotron2000 would definitely keep players on their toes even if they specifically build to counter him.

I think a reward progression system like MP would be essential, but in order to stop players from resigning against a specific AI opponent, you'd have to regress their reward tier each time they lose a battle or resign.

 

Super quick thought.

Someone mentioned (before Caverns of Chaos was released) bringing in various characters and parties, including for "showcasing" the premade parties. My thought: The Caverns' Entropic characters (including Legendary characters) might be interesting here. However, the AI limitations might deflate this particular thought.

Otherwise, clearly Caverns of Chaos helps quench the thirst in the main reason for this thread being posted, right? Yaaaay. (Nevertheless, there were other good reasons mentioned for PvE pseudo-ranked matches.)

Regards, $:^ J

 

Partly, but it would help more if I drew fewer teams with multiple elf wizards.

The part not addressed is being able to play the same monthly map rotations vs. MP styled AIs. For some, this might be the only way they could actually play them. For others, it might increase their comfort level enough to attract them to PvP. It won't work for everyone, but if a larger MP player base is still desired, this might help.

 

CoC lays the tech foundation for implementing this idea if we ever want to. I'm vaguely inclined, but am working on more important things right now

 

Technically speaking, Campaign has tough AI's.

Oh, sure, they may not position all that greatly, but, look at Grendel, for example. There's still nightmare stories about that guy simply because of the cards he holds--if he catches up to you, and you can't get away, and you have no defensive tricks up your sleeve, he will NOT beat you, he will NOT crush you, he will NOT destroy you, he will OBLITERATE you. Your chances of survival in hand-to-hand combat is slim against him, if not zero.

Mom also immediately comes to mind. Staggering Blows? in MP? Whaaaaaa? Not to mention her insanely effective blocks. She doesn't need any priests or mages--her blocks do the job of all 3 for her.

Basically, @Flaxative, you [and @Jon, for that matter] can compensate for the lack of position-competent AI with cards that are DEADLY when unleashed upon your average, garden-variety Campaigner. I said in my own suggestion thread about this subject that I have ideas for possible deck builds that I'm willing to PM any interested staffers about.