[Suggestion] Nerf Dwarf Wizards

I think it is clear that Dwarf Wizards are overpowered compared to every other race/class combination.
They get the addition of Dwarven Hit points and the OP Toughness (available 2 on an item as a common), but have much less of difficulty overcoming their movement due to most of their attacks are ranged in nature and wizards have attcks that can move people, encumber people and block movement.
The counters are fewer post nerf (granted Wizards have less in their arsenal as well) causing people to max out Team Run, and other additional movement (make elven melee teams more popular).

I don't want the fundemental structure of the game just because I don't want to join them just because I can't beat them... BUT it is clear to me that currently (as expected by many) Wizards especially D-Wiz would be in the driver's seat post-balance.

Personally I think the simplest solution would be to reduce the HPs of Human and Dwarf wizards. I would recommend reducing HPs to 21 for D-wiz and 19 for Human wiz. This hurts the Human a touch (who never seem to get anything great just for them except the Warrior Cat figure), but it brings the D-wiz down a peg.
I would also suggest changing any Dwaven Racial w/ 2 Toughness down to 1 OR nerfing Toughness so that it is either vulnerable to penentration OR nerfing Toughness so there is not a card draw.

Please share thoughts if you think I am off base or ways that 3 D-wiz is not clealry the strongest race/class combo.

 

There are ways to counter them, which makes them alright.

 

My suggestion would actually be to join them. Now before you object let me clarify - I suggest you run 3 dwarf wizards for a while for two reasons.

1) You only have half the view on whether they are overpowered or not, that is, you struggle against them which may mean they are overpowered, or it may mean that your build or your play style has a natural weakness toward them, but that they are not universally overpowered. Play them and see if you shoot up the rankings and consistently win against a variety of builds - obviously if they are overpowered this should happen.
2) If you play with wizards, you'll start to see much more easily where their weaknesses are, and what are the most difficult counters for them to deal with (both in cards and play style). Then return to your "normal" builds and see if you can use your new found wizard-frustrating knowledge to match up better against them.

After that, if you still think they're overpowered then it'd definitely be something worth looking into.
To be clear, I really don't like playing against all wizard teams, so this post is not a vote for them, just a note that such-and-such is overpowered because I always lose against them doesn't hold nearly as much weight as such-and-such is overpowered because I win way too much with them.

 

Lolwut. I stopped running wizards (except in toy builds) after the balance changes.

Smoke bomb kills wizards hard. Team run / sparkling cloth armor / sprint / team sprint / cantrip moves overpower any kind of control those wizards may offer.

The only builds I see being consistently successful now have vampire dorfs or oblit warriors, paired with a buff/nimbus priest.

 

My responses

1. Is there any class/race combo that you think is as good as D-Wiz?
2. Smoke bombs are only available to wizards meaning you need to play them to counter them best
3. I stated movement is the current best counter, but movement is inconsistent
4. I dont think D-wiz are so OP because I lose, but I would estimate it is the build I do the worst against). I see 3 wiz teams more and more (mostly D-wiz) and it is not as much fun. I played a 3 Elf Wiz team and it was a much easier battle (partially due to a weaker player as well).
5. If I use a 3 D-wiz party, I should be able to rise up in theory... except if I am always facing other 3 D-wiz parties then the advantage is gone and I am playing against people with more experience in this type of build.

But I will build a 3 D-wiz party to test my thought. I am at ~1350, if I can rise back over 1500 quickly I will post. I generally only play 10 games a week so it is tough to use me as a test case, but I do have many of the items I would want so we will see.

Gives me an excuse to use my Meow Kitty figure even if I like the Human Warrior more.

 

Or I should just make sure to have 1 wiz with 4+ smoke bombs.

 

Yes. See also: http://forums.cardhunter.com/threads/gorillas-in-the-mist-2-0.6295/

 

I'm inclined to agree with neoncat here. I think wizard is the weakest of the 3 classes right now. The nerfs to Trembling Staff, encumber, Short Perplexing Ray, and Winds Of War crippled the old 3DC build.

I personally have seen relatively few wizards in ranked multiplayer post balance. If I do see them, they tend to focus more on damage than control and are usually accompanied by a priest for Unholy Wellspring. I think I've only played against 1 or 2 triple wizard parties since the balance patch.

On the other hand, I've seen a lot of triple melee parties. Usually it's a support priest packing tons of Mass Frenzy along with some combination of big damage warriors and vampire priests. They tend to play multiple copies of Team Run as well. I think this is the strongest and most prevalent build archetype right now.

 

Personally I think wizards are weak in MP right now, and that dwarf wizards are just the best of the worst.

 

I've said this before, but there isn't a good way to make elf wizards as good a choice as dwarf wizards while working within the confines of the existing set of items. Ranged attacks simply make positioning less important, and the hp/movement tradeoff is less of a question for wizards than it is for the other classes. That said, dwarf wizards are far from dominant currently. Wizards can still do a lot of things, but the traditional 3DC builds got hit pretty hard with the balance changes. A traditional answer to them (step dwarves) got nerfed, too, but I think elf warriors and * vampires got a number of nice tools (or comparatively nice tools) for handling wizards.

Interesting comment. Who are the many? I've heard a lot of complaints about wizards being much worse after balance, and I think a lot of that is relative/biased (because dwiz were so supreme prior), and several strong players have explained that wizards are still totally viable but no longer in possession of dominant choices. But I don't think I've seen any complaints about wizard strength after balance... until now.

 

What good is Smoke Bomb if you can't see them either? Use Illusory Barrier.

 

If your opp is playing d.wizzies they are trolling you, esp. d. control wizzies. I support this thread idea, from a purely arbitrary and biased point of view. Bring them down to 21hp and remove toughness card draw. Let the NERFENZING COMMENCE !!!!

 

There is a way to make Elven Wizards more viable, but not without some new content and balance tweaks. Having Obliterating Bludgeon only do 16 damage would help and possibly giving Elves +1 hp (and Humans +1 hp) to narrow the gap in strength would work.

 

Exactly.

 

NERFENZING lol

The wizards are ok at the moment, even after the major balance. Elf wizards are still the worst class in PvP. Because maps are small, 4 step is good for warriors, but usually elves don't have enough to space to get a good value for the 4 steps since the wizards don't play in the middle of the map for obvious reasons.

Instead of nerf cards, why not improve other cards? Now there's no OP cards available, but there's a lot of useless cards.

 

I still think Toughness is OP and doubly so on a D-wiz...
Maybe I just dont know how to play without good step attacks, I never had a VP but I made good use of Vicious Thrusts. I also keep changing my builds when I get new stuff which unfortunately messes me up.

 

Just play your d wizes then with these 2xToughness items and enjoy your Rusty Armors.
Yes, dwiz is almost always the best wiz to choose, especially after the encumber nerf but I think we can live with that.

 

Toughness is very strong. One of the biggest problems with Dwarves is that they are already the most durable race due to having the highest HP... but then they get racial cards that give them even MORE durability...

 

Play as many copies of Team Run as you can. Also some weapons with step attacks are still very strong. Bejeweled Shortsword and Double-edged Sword come to mind.

 

Bejeweled Shortsword? Is that good? I never heard of it. Am I supposed to use attacks that do MORE damage?
Am i allowed to use Team run more than once? I thought it was restricted to 1 per deck...