[Feedback] MP vs SP rewards

Sooooo.... I just want to bring this to attention as something to muse over.

@Fyra - joined Mar 16, 2014 (3 months ago)
@Sir Veza - joined Sep 28, 2013 (7 months ago)

Both have 89% of the items in the game.

Sir Veza is one of the venerable old farmers. Fyra has the most MP games of all non-AI players.

I guess we all know this, but this makes it very concrete: MP ladder rewards are much, much, much, much (~133%) better than SP rewards.

Perhaps that's how it should be. Or perhaps something might be tweaked for SP, since farmers are the folks who are more likely to be trying to complete a collection...

 

That's the forum joining dates, so maybe not accurate. For example I registred on the forum 3 weeks after joining the game.

Anyway I am glad to hear this, means MP players will stop complaining

Gratz Fyra btw, good job.

No need to congratulate Sir Veza, he knows he's a deity we all worship

 

On the other hand, we don't know if their hours played are equal. Maybe Fyra has played the same amount but in a shorter calendar period. I think the useful metric would be unique item per hour played. Blue Manchu has access to that information and can adjust the balance accordingly. We don't so can only guess at it. It would be interesting to know if it's an equal value in SP and MP.

Another thing that comes to mind is how efficient is the technique used by a particular player in SP/MP for generating unique items? SP can be much more targeted this way. The metric I mentioned above would be imperfect due to the variance in personal loot chase strategies of a player (conscious startegy or not).

 

Meow! Well i had been a member for a while before i joined the forums (i guess thats where you got the time of joining)
Also. Maybe Veza is at the high end of 89% Which would be way more! A single unique item is really hard to come by at this high % (90% is at 1450, so all we know is that he have somewhere between 1434 and 1450 items). We mostly have legends left to get, and we all know how hard it is to get those.

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Edit: Also very interesting. So i guess ive been doing right by farming mp chests?

 

If you had all of the Commons, Uncommons, Rares, and Epics in the game, you would be around 83%. At that point, everything else is legendary, and the odds of getting those, especially particular legendary items, is so wild that most people are going to hit that 89% wall. No, if you really want to look at SP vs. MP, you need to look at the full collection, as in, how close is this person to getting 12 of every arcane item, 9 of every divine item, etc. I'm sure if you looked at Veza side by side with anyone, he'd come out far ahead.

 

What really helped MP in this matter lately were leagues, specially the 1 week free leagues and the current 50 gold leagues, since an epic chest is so easy to get now. I don't know how faster mp was for farming before the leagues appeared, probably it was still better because of all those gold chests in the ladder, but MP and SP weren't so far away. What really unbalanced things were leagues imo.
That said, I don't think MP is more effective, specially once you have a high percentage completed and you are only looking for specific items, like the current situation of Fyra and Sir Veza. SP gives you the opportunity of a more targeted search, as Jarmo has said.

 

Gratz Fyra!
Thanks for the kind words, Squidy!

I suspect Oberon may still be in the lead, or possibly even someone who doesn't post. Here is my Inventory Analysis for comparison:

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I think the bonus chests in MP help in finding the higher rarities, particularly for those who play to the epic chest. Leagues help a lot as well, and don't take very long to complete which is good for those with less play time available. The Loot Fairy gives a small but nice daily bump on the SP side as well. All in all, it looks like a dedicated MP farmer may have the edge in filling out a collection, and I expect Fyra to pass me before long.

I suspect SP farming still has an edge in generating gold due to the greater number of chests per hour possible and the sheer number of items dropped. My current gold balance is 24463, and my inventory excess is:

So winning leagues, daily MP to the epic, farming SP in the lags between and after the MP games, and finding the Loot Fairy a time or two per day is probably the most productive method. Thanks again to @neoncat for providing the tools to figure this stuff out!

 

Daily harvest for data. Also dat rare YAY! Tomorrow i can give you the exact number of rares/legends/epics i get. Forgot about it today.

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Total 90%1457/1611

 

I'm at 88% (almost 89%) and I barely play MP (I usually go for the 2nd Gold chest) and I rarely farm SP anymore (just the level 6 stuff for treasure and the loot fairy).

I just buy every non-Legendary item I don't own from Randimar every week... I'm at all Common, Uncommon, and Rare and only have 25 Epics left to get.

And to be fair, comparing Fyra to other people doesn't really work. She plays like 20 hours a day... :-P

EDIT: Although I do play in a ton of Leagues and get first or second place in like 90% of them... that could have a big impact as well.

 

I'm literally one item away from 90% right now and everything I'm reading in this thread only confirms that we're still not going to get any sort of accuracy on this unless we look at the full inventories and see how close people are to getting full sets of items rather than single items of each. So...how about it Neoncat? Any chance we can see a utility tool like that?

 

In theory with a random distribution and people playing every level about equally then it shouldn't matter on details of "full inventories or one of each item." It should average itself out due to the law of large numbers.

It also should be a bell curve for % of items -- it gets more and more difficult to get a higher percent. I'd be VERY surprised if someone ever gets 100% (or at least 100% within the next 6 months to a year).

 

Well, there is the collection export utility... somebody could make up a spreadsheet with the max number of items, which then spits out a percentage.

 

Excluding commons, uncommons, treasures, and holiday items, there are 852 individual items that are possible to get. If you're trying to get a complete set of every one of those items, you're looking at a total of about 5,200. The point is, it's going to take players a lot longer to reach the end of that line than the line detailing the percentage of individual items and will more accurately convey the progress of someone farming for items.

Also, Bell Curves have nothing to do with this. If you're talking about number of items versus the chance that you'll get a new unique one, that would be represented by a simple downward sloping line graph. 100% chance of getting a new rare when you don't have any, versus a .003% chance of the rare you pull from something like a golden MP chest being the one you don't have, although those percentages are obviously different for specific modules and places like Radimars.

Furthermore, the whole point of this thread is that the single biggest farmer in SP and the biggest MP farmer are NOT "playing every level about equally" and thus we're comparing their collections and trying to find out which method is more viable for farming.

 

Hmm interesting. This is my current collection, I just broke into 92% last week.

 

There's a number of things worth mentioning.

I've always figured you could do quite well with MP if you regularly were able to obtain the epic chest (especially with the treasure club). Never really got solid numbers until this thread. I've been doing better with SP since AotA hit and the performance boost, it's been easier to hit 30+ adventures a day, but it really comes down to how many days a week you're chasing. Wouldn't really bother me if MP gave better rewards anyway, it's in the interest of the game to build the MP audience.

It's worth mentioning that MP rewards are more random, with the rewards any possible level. Where as SP rewards are more targeted. So in SP it's in you really want to pay attention to what levels you don't really need anymore. At this point I skip most of the low level adventures because I have everything except for 2 level 1 legendaries, so now I just do the 2 level 2 adventures each day. This same problem should make it harder for a pure MP player to track down the ever dwindling number of unique legendaries.

Though at the same time, I expect many of us focusing on SP have a lot of lvl 18 legendaries remaining to be found. Personally I still need 31 of them, plus another 4 lvl 17s. And let's face it, reliably farming the lvl 18's to completion is a very different experience than farming the kobolds.

 

You know...I'm gonna go out on a limb here after seeing all these people with one or two missing rares and say that one a lot of people are probably missing is...Novice Crushing, am I right?

 

Since we're all posting our sets, I'm gonna post mine and gloat that I have all Rares... excepting the White Star. The one uncommon is Blackglass Token.




And with Treasures, since that's what I'm actually after:

 

Have it. But I'm well behind the posts in this thread overall.

 

For me it's Yolotli Armor. I'm still speed farming Swamp King for hours most days, and getting everything but.