Cancelling Moves - Thoughts and Suggestions

Introduction
I've noticed a few people point out that it's strange that move cards cannot be cancelled, and personally I agree with them. I thought I'd try and outline the problem for people who are unfamiliar with it and offer my own ideas for possible solutions. This post may end up quite long; are you sitting comfortably? Then I'll begin...

The Problem
Any card containing a move (i.e. blue and half-blue cards) cannot be cancelled once clicked. To the best of my knowledge all other cards, except traits which must be played, can be cancelled after clicking. It is not immediately obvious why this should be and seems inconsistent, which could cause confusion and frustration particularly for new players.

The Reason
When selecting a move card are cards that can trigger in reaction to the move. For example, encumber attachments can reduce movement distance while boosts like Rushing Aura can increase it. These are static, they always apply to every move, so no problem there. I believe the issue arises due to chance-based cards like Slowed. Before you roll the die you don't know how far you can move and hence which squares are legal locations. In comparison to attacks there are no cards (that I know of) that reduce the range of an attack. There are cards like Jump Back that increase the distance between the attacker and the target but these work slightly differently: if the target ends up out of range the whole attack is invalidated. My interpretation of the current sequences is as follows:

The Move Sequence
1. Mouseover card, valid locations ignoring all modifiers are shown.
2. Select card. Reaction cards, which may be chance-based, immediately trigger. Point of no return.
3. Valid spaces to move to are shown (may be different from 1).
4. Player selects a valid square.

The Attack Sequence
1. Mouseover card, valid targets are shown.
2. Select card.
3. Valid targets are shown (same as in 1).
4. Player can cancel, otherwise select a valid target. Point of no return.
5. Reaction cards, which may be chance-based, trigger.
6a. If the target is still valid, resolve the attack.
-or-
6b. If the target is now invalid, nullify the attack in the same manner as a block.

Possible Solutions
Note that I have no idea how difficult these would be to implement and they are considered purely from a single-player perspective.Does multiplayer add further complications?
A. The Simplest Approach. No card can be cancelled once it has been clicked. Pro: completely consistent. Con: completely unforgiving. I think I'd prefer this to the current system.
B. Are You Sure? Have a confirmation step for moves, say, clicking on the card again. So select card -> confirm or cancel card -> reactions trigger. Pro: moves can be cancelled; probably not that hard to implement(?). Con: an extra mouse click every time you want to play a move. Still not quite consistent with attacks.
C. All or Nothing. When move cards are selected spaces which you can definitely reach are shown in blue. Spaces which you may be able to reach depending on die rolls are shown in another colour, e.g. purple. You can then either cancel or select a space. Select a blue space and you move as normal, with all reactions showing as normal. Select a purple space and all reactions trigger. If the space becomes invalid due to chance-based cards, you don't move at all. Pro: much more consistent with attacks. Con: chance-based, movement-affecting cards become more dangerous. Difficult to explain. Difficult to implement(?) Alternative - Close Enough: you end up in the closest legal space to the one you were originally aiming for.
D. Pick Again. When you select a movement card legal squares including all static modifiers are shown. You can then cancel or pick a square. Static modifier cards are then shown and chance-based cards trigger. If the square becomes invalid then a different square can be selected, with the newly updated possible locations shown. Pro: move cards can be cancelled, imo slightly more elegant than B. Con: still inconsistent with attacks.

Other Weirdness
Hybrid move and attack cards cannot be cancelled even though reactions to movement do not occur until after the attack. Now that's inconsistent. I know it has been mentioned before but I definitely consider it a bug that encumbrance etc. does not affect these cards, and something that should be fixed.

And Finally...
Thank you for reading my ramblings; please let me know if I have made any mistakes. Constructive criticism and other thoughts appreciated. Do you think that it's a problem that move cards cannot be cancelled?

 

I think "D. Pick Again" is the best solution -- but I would add the visual cue that spaces that might not be reached due to modifiers be shown in gray instead of blue.

This has effect of the most common move situations not be encumbered by extra prompts, etc.

 

Jon has repeatedly voiced how much simplicity is valued by the Dev's. Which is one reason why I am content with the way things work now. In any game if your not paying attention then your bound to mess up. So, just learn from your mistakes and missteps. You'll be a better player for having made them.

 

Lance, that is a mistake interacting with the game not a mistake in the game. It is (somewhat) like turning up to a Hell's angels ride in pink Hello Kitty leathers, you're not likely to go on the ride (hospitalisation? ostracism?) but there is nothing about your outfit that changes the practicality of riding a motor bike. It is like that silly rule in chess that if you accidentally knock your king over moving a different piece you lose. (Not everyone plays that rule by the way).

Having said that, I appreciate the need for a 'simple' solution to this problem. Personally I'd just trigger all effects upon committing (selecting the square to move to) to moving rather than on clicking on the card. Potentially allowing the server to decide which route you use if the move was shortened or allowing the player to pick again...

 

Out of these options I like A. I make mistakes with moves because I fall into the habit of clicking attacks and then checking what I can target. If that was point of no return for everything then I would actually remember to consistently check with hover or right-click on every card.

Alternately wouldn't it be possible to program so that a card is not revealed when the active player selects it but rather after they select it's targets?

 

As per usual, I support making all cards "uncancellable," not just Move cards. It doesn't matter if ONLY Move cards have this funny "other things might be triggered" deal: in the future, Blue Manchu might easily make triggers react to other sorts of cards, too. Imagine, say, a weird enemy ability that forces all your multi-target Attacks to instead hit a single target: that would trigger off of an Attack and be revealed, thus leading to annoyance if you could cancel your Attack.

Also, for clarification:

The biggest concern is NOT the ACTIVE PLAYER's card: we're talking about the other players having their cards revealed because they triggered on a Move. Very offensive if you could cancel your Move after seeing your enemy's card.

 

I'm voting for A. This game needs to be unforgiving for your mistakes. When you play cards without giving much of a second thought, then yes, it is your fault. Feel the consequences.

 

Are we allowing a selection of A(1) All cards are "uncancellable" unless there's no valid target? Or will that attack just fizzle and you lose the card?

 

Option A is preferable to the current inconsistant interface. I would just add the caveats that (1) the card is automatically cancelled if there are no targets and (2) there is a "are you sure?" dialog if the only targetable characters are your own allies. There is value in being newbie-friendly.

 

I support "1," come to think of it.

I do not, however, support "2." I presume we're talking about Step-Attack cards again, because the current system for (regular) Attack cards is even friendlier: they do not show you the option to attack allies unless you hit control-click, thus avoiding slowing down the game with "are you sure?" dialog. If they're going to change the code, I encourage them to change it so that Step-Attack cards behave as closely to regular Attack cards as they can: with the destination overlay not showing you squares where you are forced to attack an ally (unless you hit control-click).

Yes, this is the same attitude I keep repeating in every thread. Yes, I still think that it addresses most concerns.

 

My suggestion was unclear. After selecting a move card you are shown how any current reaction attachments or cards in YOUR hand would affect the move. You make your choice, the card is now revealed to your enemy, reactions occur and then movement. This way you can move the same way as attacks currently work. Select it, see it, undo it before committing without your cards being shown and enemy reactions Bering given away.

I'm not sure this works but I don't actually know of any cards that react from hand on the playing of an opponents move card, but before the movement, yet.
I'm still for A (1) though, just alternatives

 

Yes, those exist, hence the concern: Reactive Trip is an example we've brought up before in such threads.

 

I have lost a multiplayer game, and seen others lose multiplayer games to me from clicking move when they didn't mean to.

The simplest solution is....

E: Have an option called 'confirmation on move' in the options screen, selecting this enables it for players who want to go down the path of having a confirmation dialogue, but doesn't require it. It would be off by default.

Problem solved, win win, no cons.

 

I definitely lean towards there being a problem with a move card not being able to be cancelled. Even in single player I've made that mistake before, only to end up having to waste the card because I really don't want to move. I understand the logic behind why they cannot be cancelled from an engineering standpoint, but that could be fixed by having a confirmation prompt like others have mentioned.

I feel that this especially disadvantages newer players who are less familiar with the game, because such mistakes can feel frustrating and take the "fun" factor away from the game. Experienced players would already know about how easy it is to make this mistake and so they consciously avoid it. But there's no reason to have such an annoyance in the first place. It'll be best for everyone across the board if there is at least a "Are you sure? You can't take this move back!" prompt for movement cards.

 

I wouldn't say cancelling a move is needed,
though a security "Do you wish to move?" question
before starting the 'moving phase' might be in order,
due to movement cards (not attack cards with movement)
nature of behaviour.

 

Well, there is no "moving phase": there's just a "it's-your-turn-to-play-anything phase." And Attack cards that include movement are a really big concern for this cancellation rule, since you can't hurt yourself quite literally.

Unfortunately, I still don't see what a confirmation dialog is supposed to accomplish. You get at least one Move card every turn, and ALMOST all movement is so casual and fast that you don't need to "confirm" anything. Making a big deal of "egad, you're about to play a MOVE CARD," interrupting the player and slowing down the game for what is USUALLY a triviality, seems like solving a problem by making a more-pervasive problem. Bane, I would argue that it doesn't matter if it's optional: anyone who turned the option on would turn it off in frustration after perhaps two rounds.

duckroll: are you suggesting a single-time prompt, not a "we will interrupt you every time you click a Move card" prompt? That might be better. However, the player already has to learn a lot at the start of the game, and they've almost reached saturation on tutorial prompts. Again, if the behavior were consistent (you can't take back any cards, Move or otherwise), then the player could actually learn this game rule by playing the game and there'd be neither confusion nor excess prompts.

 

Well I was thinking of an optional you could turn on and off,
Alternatively before the card is counted as chosen, due to the
way those movement cards work, you would have to click them
twice with min. 1sec break between ...I actually think it might be
a better option than a confirmation dialog.