Vengeance needs a saving roll

And acid deserves a turn at the MOT (most important terrain), I say.

I'm wondering if a fleet of fleet, adaptable, inquisitor badge wearing elf wizards might work here as well.

 

I think the real issue is the stacking. Getting to Move 2 twice out of nowhere gives such huge variance. There's counterplay once it's revealed. But I think no character should ever, ever get a move 2 x2 cantrip, since one who's playing carefully (read: smartly) will just drown in calculations knowing that's a possibility.

I recall one instance where the opponent's warrior, in round 2, moved twice with Vengeance after my elf wizard used Melt Armor at range 5 and then immediately followed it with a buffed Pulverizing Hack. Not fun.

 

But warriors, who benefit from cantrip moves far more than the other classes, can only get one copy of SPA (priests can get 2 and wizards can get 3).

 

And, notice that for a wizard to stack those Armors on that Robes item, Vulnerable comes with it. And oh yeah, four player-accessible direct-Armor-removal cards, not including Armor-removal terrain. (Also not including generic discards which function equally in either case.)

But it's okay. Warriors get some Vengeance Handicap items, too: Blind Rage! ~laughing out loud, mixed with genuine gaming anguish~ (On an almost unrelated note, kiss your next-round safe position good-bye if you're a priest who previously irradiated some Blind Rage onto the warrior. After all, the opp is "damage from an enemy card." Bah.)

 

I posted this mostly for laughs, but I gotta say that two copies of Short Perplexing Ray in my deck saved me a lot of times against Vengeance. Also, Vampire's Kiss was annoying when I had Vengeance.

 

If Short Perplexing Ray wasn't so random (well, more random the more cards someone has) and didn't have the move cancelled if the card is blocked, I'd be all about it. Not sure what can be done with it, however.

Memory Loss can be great as well, but it's only on staves, and any arcane item that allows for decent synergy is either or token-less with Maze being the best idea when dealing with Vengeance. If Maze was some sort of 1-round Hypno Beacon attachment, I'd be all for it, but more often that not, it doesn't help when an enemy is close by, or can hurt you if you use it from far away.

I know you were not being serious, but just thought I'd add to this idea.

 

Okay, what about Telepod Jaunt then? haha.

 

I am told the current itemisation for Short Perplexing Ray (SPR) comes from an era when it discarded 2 cards, not 1. So these items seem overpriced. If SPR preferred revealed cards to not-revealed then it would directly counter vengeance, plus help a bit with armor:

"Target discards a random revealed card else a random non-revealed card. Then you move 1". ​

That would make it a) worth the current item cost and b) be a bit less random. Sure it is a bit more wordy. But no more wordy than cards we often see like Elven Maneuvers.

 

You're assuming that SPR was properly valued before and that nerfing it took it out of balance, when in fact it was the opposite.

 

Oh I agree two card discard is OP and nerfing made sense. So my assumption is that it was nerf'd hard for the sake of simplicity and is now slightly under powered.

 

Possible, though the hard nerf was to make it discard one card period. From there it was raised to discard one card and move 1. So this is the buffed, nerfed version.

 

It would be perfect if the move did not cancel if it is blocked. I'd be so happy with it then.

 

Also, telekinesis losing the ability to teleport is rough now as well.

In any event, the best strategy I have found so far is to play for a timeout with max control (9 gusts of war, 7 telekinesis, 2 force bolts, and 2 hypno beacons per wizard) keep away. It works for about 20 of the 40 total minutes available for the game, which is more than double of any other three wizard strategy I can determine. By that point, however, I've had to use every card in my deck, and the opponent has had the ability to amass a ton of cards, so the bottom falls out. Adding encumber to this mix made things worse, which was surprising to me, but then again, it wasn't.

Seeing as how a three wizard solution did not work, I will have to see if a two wizard or one wizard solution will work. In any event, the mind-numbing matches of warriors who cannot be damaged vs. everyone's bane of control would be over quicker.

I'd probably pay someone to make a build for me at this point, it's that frustrating that 2+ years of refining a wizard's closet goes for naught because warriors apparently needed more movement.

 

I havent seen this discussed yet, and i assume an attempt at changing it wont get past the restrictions of the code and how things are processed in CH, but i am annoyed vengeance cant be undone or dampered before it unfolds its full effect. Root and Ice damage still trigger the full 2 squares, then the aftereffects hit. Vampires Kiss might discard vengeance, but the target still gets to move first.
But especially with roots i would like to see them grounded right away.

 

How about Inquisitor's Badge reads...

This Armor grants Immunity to Silver (...) and all damage caused by an enemy with a revealed Silver attack.

 

Inq Badge is plenty strong, I think vengeance losing 1 point of damage should make it not soo popular.

 

Yeah -1 damage was covered in the vote. I was bringing up a new idea. Inquisitor says no!!

 

I like the new idea but it sounds like it could be a coding nightmare.